Yesterday, the always execrable David Frum co-opted the heartbreaking tragedy in Newtown, Conn., in an attempt to ghoulishly score a few cheap laughs. “Obviously, we need to lower the age limit for concealed carry so toddlers can defend themselves,” he tweeted.

Repulsive.

But he wasn’t done sloshing around in the blood of 20 murdered children just yet. Punctuating his tweets with the hashtag “#thinking,” Frum is still slinging what he’s deluded himself into believing are ingeniously witty rejoinders to his critics (also known as decent people).

“Last week: teachers’ unions are the enemy. This week: arm unionized teachers with semi-automatics to prevent gun violence. #thinking,” he sneered while trying to score a few political points on the backs of the dead. And then this:

Because, you know, #thinking. Then he dropped the #thinking hashtag. Appropriate, no?

The only response his tweets warrant is disgust. But this about sums Frum up:

Frum also responded to yesterday’s critics on his Daily Beast blog, announcing that no apology was due (feel free to Google for it if you must). Then he lashed out at Twitchy and the hundreds of people disgusted by his callous mockery of the tragedy.

I’ll accept no lectures about “sensitivity” on days of tragedy like today from people who work the other 364 days of the year against any attempt to prevent such tragedies.

No Labels, no lectures, no apologies.

What a despicable little man.

Update:

The dishonest anti-gun trolling continues:

Frum, of course, is quite familiar with statistical farces.

Straw man-palooza!

And what’s the rape rate down under, hmm?

Oh, for the love of everything ever! Enough already.

  • Tim

    Typical liberal scum!

  • EOD

    Last Week Democrats said “There Will Be Blood, There will be Repercussions”

    Last Week the Unions called for Civil War.

    The Left did not come out againt the Michigan Democrats who called for Blood.

    The Left did not come out against Jimmy Hoffa who called for a Civil War.

    The Left always blames Freedom for the problems, every problem in the Nation…. instead of just looking in the mirror

    • V the K

      Also, last week, Jamie Foxx got big laughs from a joke about “killing all the white people.”

      • fmahoney

        You need not worry about that! blacks are killing there own at an alarming rate. Most of the guns are illegal and many are drug related.

        Middle class white suburbia children are boing killed!!! Not by blacks or minorities or muslims but by the legal guns and high powered assault rifles.

        Welcome to the war zone on elementary school not by the boogie man from the bad side of town but by the kid next door, the educated college student on and on. Welcome to the daily reality of the getto.

        This stuff always comes back to bite you in the ass. Drugs more drugs more drugs.

        Guns more guns more guns over 10,000 deaths by guns in the us. A constant war zone

        Chicken are coming home to roost

  • Jefferson Tea Party

    If I can’t trust you with a gun, why would I trust you with my kid?

  • Danny Wheeler

    Frum needs to shut up. He obviously isn’t “thinking”.

  • kate_middleton

    David Frum – Grade A Douchebag.

  • http://twitter.com/Edward_von_Bear Edward von Bear

    He’s lowered himself to trolling stage just to get attention and an invite to MSNBC to join Scarborough, J Weaver (The Huntsman Guy), and Matthew Dowd

  • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

    He has a point your side makes teachers the bad guys but the principal and teachers ran to their death. Conservatives need to stop bashing teachers they will literally die for your kids.

    • kate_middleton

      I don’t think anyone bashes teachers. The vast majority of teachers are wonderful people. My mom is a Kindergarten teacher.
      Teachers unions are a big problem with education in this country. Many teachers will tell you this as well. Teachers unions put kids’ education last. Their goal is to keep every failing school open, keep every failing teacher employed, and to not allow education reform. Fact.

      • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

        Maybe it’s the word choice because I couldn’t believe how negative the right wing were to a group that deserves so much respect.

        • kate_middleton

          Educate yourself. There’s a HUGE difference between teachers and teachers UNIONS.
          Anyone who says GOP hates teachers is intellectually dishonest.

          • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

            So the whole home school failed schools is a lie?

          • kate_middleton

            Doug, you don’t make sense. I’m getting dumber trying to converse with you.

          • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

            Ha you can pretend that conservatives do not have a home school movement.

          • kate_middleton

            What are you talking about? No one even mentioned home school.
            If people want to home school their kids, go for it. I don’t care. Why do you?

          • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

            You are being dishonest because conservatives have always bashed the public school system, I didn’t need yesterday were 3 people gave their life for those kids to know teachers are heroes, if you are claiming your side didn’t teacher bash than I don’t know what to say.

          • kate_middleton

            False. My mom is a public school teacher. I am a product of public schools. The school system needs serious reform though. Anyone who says it’s fine is delusional.

            You don’t understand logic and you’re making grossly incorrect assumptions. As I said before, I’m getting dumber trying to converse with you, so I must stop. Have a good day.

          • $23901791

            Yes, my teacher wife and I have decided to home school our child. The school system, not the teachers, are to blame for the failed education system. How is that teacher bashing? Private schools also perform better and are full of teachers. We don’t go around bashing private schools, though they have the fact that they have teachers in common with public schools. Heck, we’d send our child to private school if we could afford it, but we’re a middle class family who can’t, so we’re going to home school.

            What we’re doing is UNION BASHING. You know that, though. You’re just trying to twist the argument for the sake of emotional argument (pathos), just to paint us as teacher haters.

            And, no, teachers aren’t all heroes. Just educating a child doesn’t make you a hero. It makes you a service provider. Firefighters are heroes. They risk their lives to save the lives of others.

            Teachers that sacrifice their lives to save the children are heroes BECAUSE they sacrificed, not because they’re teachers.

          • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

            I thought Romney said we didn’t need more firefighters? Your side will always bash the non wealthy. I’m saying most teachers would die for their students. I wasn’t shocked I bet the number who would die for students would shock you.

          • $23901791

            That’s simply unrealistic. Most HUMAN BEINGS wouldn’t die for others, unless it’s their own family. Teachers are not particularly a cut above the rest. You can’t say “most”.

            BTW, I AM the non wealthy.

            I wasn’t shocked, either. There were a small few who did it and they were great people. You’re diminishing their individual accomplishment by insisting it’s just a normal thing for people in their line of work when it isn’t.

            Furthermore, my mother-in-law is a teacher; my wife is a teacher; my best friend is a teacher. Don’t assume I don’t know anything about teachers, or would be shocked by their behavior.

            It SHOULD be taken for granted that most teachers are as you described, but what is TRULY shocking is what I learned first hand…that most are not and many (though not most), care about nothing but what they can get for themselves. Most, though, are just trying to do their job; neither good nor bad, they’re decent. I’ve met these teachers first hand; the good, the decent, and the bad.

            This poor girl, Victoria Soto, did something almost no human being would do in this kind of situation. She is a saint, and you’re trying to take it away from her by saying it’s just the normal pattern of behavior for teachers in order to score some political points for your side.

          • $23901791

            To tell you the truth, I doubt my own wife would do what Victoria Soto did. My wife would have thought of our daughter and tried to make sure she came home to her, rather than risk herself to save other people’s kids…and my wife is one of the better teachers.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            You are correct. The natural default is for humans to preserve themselves (the so-called “flight or fight” mechanism). Taking a bullet or putting oneself in the line of other potentially mortal danger is counter to our instincts and evolution. Running from danger is what has kept us alive as a species during some otherwise very fateful periods in history. To do otherwise is counter-intuitive and requires either an exceptional dedication to others, intensive training, or both.

          • wwbdinct

            It’s not all about YOU.

          • Finrod Felagund

            He’s a troll, to him it’s always all about him.

          • Finrod Felagund

            He’s a troll, to him it’s always all about him.

          • lainer51

            and “your side” will always bash the wealthy. So no one is right or wrong, it’s just the way it is. Do you really KNOW most teachers would die for their students, or is that your uneducated guess again?

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Well, I have to disagree with your opening statement. I’m a former high school teacher (8 years) and have received state and national recognition. In my experience in public education, 90% of the teachers are the problem. I can count on both hands the number of truly professional, competent, caring teachers that I worked with (with some fingers left over!) And sadly a lot of those bad, unaccomplished, uncaring teachers get promoted in administrator positions and hire other people just like them. I saw it day-in-and-day-out for 8 years. It’s the major reason I left the profession. And, no, I didn’t want to be an administrator. I found in most cases, the really good teachers just wanted to teach, and have that effort properly supported by the district and state-level bureaucrats. The teacher unions are in large part to blame, because they create a culture and mechanism in which is it damn near impossible to get rid of the slimy hangers-on, and that in turn discourages competent educators from joining the public education system. It’s truly a f@$#%d up mess and under Arne Duncan, whom I’ve personally met and spoken with, it really isn’t getting any better.

            Agree those teachers and administrators who stepped up and made the ultimate sacrifice for those kids are heroes, albeit dead ones. I wish one of them had a CCW semi-automatic pistol because two hits to that clown’s ocular-cranial cavity would have produced an entirely difference outcome for those 20 lost angels.

          • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

            Look at the educational level of many graduating high school seniors and it’s easy to wonder what they were being taught, if anything.

          • wwbdinct

            No one “needed” yesterday. It’s not all about YOU.

          • lainer51

            please don’t tease us like that— “I don’t know what to say”…. if only

          • Ken Alan Draper

            because if the public schools close down, the teachers will be unemployed, if they are unemployed they pay no union dues, if they pay no union dues the union lays off Doug & he has to get a real job.

          • $23901791

            We do. So? I still don’t know what point you’re making. What failed home schooling? Facts don’t support your argument.

          • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

            Was that a statement or a question?

          • Ken Alan Draper

            Me thinks Doug is sitting in a teachers union office earning his internet propagandist paycheck. the left spends a lot of money on people to troll comment sections trying to paint their extremeism as mainstream.

          • $23901791

            Home schooling performs higher. I don’t know what point you’re trying to make.

        • $23901791

          My wife is a teacher and she and I both are against teachers unions. Stop making overly simplistic generalizations about conservative arguments. MANY teachers who leave school to go protest for more benefits are shameful. I GUARANTEE those aren’t the same teachers who are willing to die for their kids.

          • kate_middleton

            Amen! My mom says the same thing. She doesn’t think teachers should have tenure and she is against the unions (and lives in a state where joining the union is optional, so she is not a member). There are some bad teachers she’s worked with over the years. She thinks teachers should be evaluated on their performance in the classroom – just like any other profession is.

          • $23901791

            Tenure actually hurts younger teachers. If funding is cut and layoffs needed, they will always cut the teachers that do not have tenure, even if they significantly outperform those that do. My wife is also not a union member.

          • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

            Yes only republican teachers will die for students, it’s shameful to want benefits? So I guess we need to take away benefits from soldiers?

          • $23901791

            It is shameful to put your benefits ahead of your students and to even treat your students as props for your protest. As for only Republicans…you put words into my mouth. All I said is that MANY of the protesting teachings put their own interests above their students. Heck, some of those selfish teachers could vote Republican.

          • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

            You want to compare teacher’s union benefits with military benefits? I’m guessing you never enlisted.

          • lainer51

            do you ever think about anything you write? It is just gibberish on top of gibberish.

    • Finrod Felagund

      It’s not our fault that you can’t tell the difference between bashing teachers and bashing teachers’ unions. You should try reading for comprehension sometime, it will keep you from looking like an idiot at least.

      • Hearns-Jackson-Hagler-Jones

        Your side bashed the actual teachers.

        • SDN

          Liar.

          • lainer51

            pathological

        • $23901791

          What SDN said.

    • Ken Alan Draper

      what are you talking about? we point out the abuse the parents, students, & the taxpayers take from monopolistic unions & point out the utterly irresponsible behavior of a small percentage of teachers who cannot be fired due to the rediculous union contracts & you see that as an attack on all teachers? you really need to learn some basic critical thinking skills.

  • salvagesalvage

    I’ll accept no lectures about “sensitivity” on days of tragedy like
    today from people who work the other 364 days of the year against any
    attempt to prevent such tragedies.

    Wingnuts won’t answer that point because it’s quite true.

    Just like Iraq when you’re wrong you won’t even begin to consider it much less take responsibility.

    Children die so you can feel secure.

    Yes, yes, CHICAGOLAND! proves that gun control does work except Canada, the Uk, Australia, Europe, Japan, etc. proves it does.

    But facts and wingnuts, never shall the two meet.

    • $23901791

      Except…it doesn’t.

      A better example is to look state by state, since we have similar cultures (unless you want me to throw places like Mexico, North Korea, and Ethiopia out there). Also, if you go by ratio of gun ownership, rather than gun laws, you see that many of the most violent countries have a lower per capita gun ownership. Honduras has really permissive gun laws, but is 88th in gun ownership and is probably the most violent country in the world. El Salvador is second in violence and 92nd in gun ownership. See where I’m going with this?

      Anyway back to my original point. The states with the highest per capita gun ownership has the lowest per capita crime. Do not use absolute number (more gun owners = more crimes), since they are dishonest reporting and have more to do with high population numbers than gun ownership. Always look at RATIOS.

      On the flip side of country ownership rate vs crime rate look at the following high gun ownership nations:

      Switzerland

      Cyprus

      Finland

      Serbia

      Sweden

      Iraq

      Saudi Arabia

      Uruguay is the only country of the top ten gun ownership to be higher than our 4.2% crime rate and they’re still at 5.9.

      Whereas Honduras has 91.6% crime rate and 6.2% gun ownership (compared to our 4.2% crime rate and 88.8% gun ownership rate.

      • salvagesalvage

        Simple question, do guns make it easier or harder to kill someone?

        • $23901791

          You’re using overly simplistic arguments. Of course it makes it easier, hence why less crime. Force becomes equalized and bullies and madmen made less potent. That’s the entire point. It makes it so that it is just as easy for a potential victim to kill an attacker as it is for the attacker to kill the villain. Hence, it insert GREATER risk onto the part of the attacker.

          I noticed you decided to refrain from arguing against the statistics that debunked your original point, by the way, and instead deflected the argument into sophomoric logic.

          • salvagesalvage

            By your “logic” crime and rampages like this should be less in America and more and other places and they are not. It’s the exact opposite.

            I know, I know, if only there were more guns in America then there would be less shooting!

            Wingnuts and their fantasies of the bad guy being taken down by an armed citizen, it never happens yet that doesn’t get in the way of you thinking it does.

          • AMSilver

            Between 1977 and 1992, ten states adopted nondiscretionary concealed-handgun laws. The data collected from after the new laws were enacted show that the mean per-capita death rate from mass shootings dropped 69-percent. Lott expounds: “although the total number of deaths and injuries from mass public shootings actually rises slightly immediately after a nondiscretionary concealed-handgun law is implemented, it quickly falls after that, with the rate reaching zero five years after the law is enacted.”

            Simply put, when a gunman is left to shoot, uninterrupted by a civilian with a gun on hand, more people die. Very restrictive gun control, like not allowing concealed-carry, will guarantee that no civilian has the means by which to shoot back to end such a massacre. The assailant, however, will always have means of getting his hands on a gun illegally.

            More evidence of this is that since 1997, the two school shootings (out of eight total) with the least amount of people injured or killed were both stopped by citizens with guns (before police even arrived at the scene).

            In one of the shootings, the assistant principal of a high school in Pearl, Miss., prevented the shooter from continuing his rampage at the nearby junior high school, where he could have killed countless more victims. The assistant principal retrieved his .45-caliber pistol from his pickup and apprehended the shooter until police arrived.

            Moreover, in the study of states that enacted right-to-carry laws between 1977 and 1999, the overall occurrence of multiple-victim shootings dropped by a remarkable 67-percent. “Deaths from all these shootings plummeted by 75 percent, and injuries by 81 percent.”

            In all this data, there’s a stunningly consistent trend that very much favors concealed-carry: gunmen prefer unarmed targets, and they will scope out their targets to find those most likely to be unarmed. In states that have right-to-carry laws, the very rare mass shootings tend to happen “in particular places where concealed handguns are forbidden, such as schools.” It’s all the same in a gunman’s eyes: localities where citizens are prohibited from carrying firearms are just as good of targets as gun free zones such as schools.

          • salvagesalvage
          • $23901791

            Not so. I just listed examples proving your assertion wrong. All of the top ten highest countries in terms of gun ownership have low violent crime rates (ours included…our rate is MUCH below the world average). But, you’re recycling the same claim, that is easily demonstrated as false. Furthermore, you make no allowance for the difference in culture when you compare country by country. State by state analysis is much more succinct and the correlation between rate of gun ownership and violent crime within the United States shows the states with the lowest violent crime rates have the highest rate of gun ownership.

            http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/02/guns_save_lives.html

            Many examples of the “bad guy” actually being taken down by an armed citizen….because it “never happens” (never is a strong word, that only one example can disprove…but there are hundreds here):

            http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/xcinfobase.asp?catid=43

            http://www.akdart.com/gun3.html

            http://www.learnaboutguns.com/tag/self-defense-example/

          • salvagesalvage

            CAN YOU READ?

            2. Eleven of the 20 worst mass shootings in the last 50 years took place in the United States.

            Time has the full list here. In second place is Finland, with two entries.

            CAN YOU READ?

            9. States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

            Last year, economist Richard Florida dove deep into the correlations between gun deaths and other kinds of social indicators. Some of what he found was, perhaps, unexpected: Higher populations, more stress, more immigrants, and more mental illness were not correlated with more deaths from gun violence. But one thing he found was, perhaps, perfectly predictable: States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths. The disclaimer here is that correlation is not causation. But correlations can be suggestive:

            CAN.
            YOU.
            READ?

            But I’m sure keepandbearamrs.com is super fair and balanced and almost certainly has no agenda.

            Just say it, you love guns, they make you feel like a powerful man and you long for the day when some Black teenagers are playing their music too loud and you can go Full John McClain on them.

          • $23901791

            It’s irrelevant how fair and balanced they are. They have FACTUAL EXAMPLES of private citizens either successfully defending themselves or saving lives through the use of firearms. You said it never happens.

            Certainly, we’ve had a lot of shootings here. I never said we hadn’t. Europe’s shootings result in more deaths, on average. That still means we’ve had more total deaths, though. But the point is that ours don’t have the monopoly on killings.

            “States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths.” And states with tighter baseball bat control with have fewer baseball bat related deaths. It’s a ridiculous assertion on its face. Stick with the correlation between gun ownership and violent crime (regardless of implement used).

            I remember a Brady campaign item that once said that 99% of gun related deaths were caused by guns (not a perfect quote, I know…it was a long time ago). I wonder what the other 1% of gun related deaths were caused by…magic?

          • salvagesalvage

            And for eveyr FACTUAL EXAMPLE you have I have far more cases of people being gunned down not just by lunatics but by loved ones in horrific accidents.

            Here’s an awesome example of what your gun love does:

            http://articles.cnn.com/2011-01-14/justice/massachusetts.gun.show.verdict_1_christopher-bizilj-westfield-sportsman-s-club-gun-show?_s=PM:CRIME

            And on any given day punch the word “accident” into Google news:

            https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=ca&tbm=nws&q=accidnet&oq=accidnet&gs_l=news-cc.3..43j43i400.2635.4354.0.4545.8.4.0.4.4.0.90.320.4.4.0…0.0…1ac.1.hZeOC5LWlew#hl=en&tbo=d&gl=ca&tbm=nws&sclient=psy-ab&q=accidently&oq=accidently&gs_l=serp.3…17352.17750.0.17939.2.2.0.0.0.0.94.185.2.2.0…0.0…1c.1.TewUm7QT7E8&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1355325884,d.aWc&fp=85a0945be760066a&bpcl=39967673&biw=1488&bih=878

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Yes, all of your examples happen everyday, just like auto accidents, stabbings, etc.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Can we say “legally mandated training”? And I’m not talking about the 4-hour bullshit CCW classroom that most states require. I’m talking about a professionally managed, 40-hour course covering safety, tactics, and legal use of deadly force, and you either pass or you don’t get a gun. And if you do pass it, you’re free to open carry, concealed carry in all 50 states including the communist socialist republic of California.

            And when everybody agrees and we all comply with all these legal requirements, the assclown who wants to kill a classroom full of kids will still illegally acquire a firearm, storm a school, and kill them anyway.

            So WTF did THAT accomplish?

            Sadly, you just don’t get it.

          • salvagesalvage

            >e communist socialist republic of California.

            See, that just shows how clearly wingnut you are.

            You know if his mom didn’t have a gun collection for him to loot it probably would have been hard for him to shoot anyone.

            Five guns whose only purpose is to kill people, why would anyone want that in their home? What possible scenario could justify that kind of hardware in a home with children? Zombie / alien / Russia attack I guess but I think the odds are pretty slight.

            No, she had them because she treated them like toys, too bad she didn’t collect video games.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Don’t make speculations that you can’t back up. You are again using your scare tactics to rationalize your arguments.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Actually you should learn to read and keep yourself updated on current events. Otherwise, you just sound like a talking points parrot for the fringe fascist left. The mother is now purported be one of the fringe “doomsday preppers” (according to people who were close to her) and had ostensibly purchased the guns are part of that “lifestyle.” Doesn’t excuse the fact that she had a legal and moral obligation to secure them away from her ‘special’ kid and she apparently failed to do that, keeping in mind that none of us know at this point what the particular circumstances are surround those firearms. Still, it looks like the proverbial nut didn’t fall far from the tree.

          • salvagesalvage

            for the fringe fascist left.

            HAHAHAHAHAH!

          • $23901791

            BTW, your increasingly bad attitude is not winning you any converts.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            The recent tragedies have happened in states with some of the strictest gun laws in the US. Please update your talking points.

          • salvagesalvage

            Yes, strict gun laws in the US means nothing, what’s strict? You can’t have a shorter barrel on your military shot gun? You can’t have “Cop killer” bullets? They tried to pass sane laws but the NRA and idiots neutered those “strict” laws to jokes.

            And where did the lunatic in this case get his guns? Have you read about those emerging details yet?

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            I’ve obviously read more than you have and am more educated than you are when it comes to guns and rifles. All of the terms you’ve referenced are media coined terms. The guns didn’t belong to the shooter, have you read that yet? You have no clue what gun laws in the US are and you have no clue that the military isn’t governed by civilian gun laws.

          • salvagesalvage

            Yes, the belonged to his mother who collected them, five so far, five guns, who needs that many for “home defense”?

            So those super-strict gun laws are so strict that the people living there can have arsenals.

            WHAT COULD GO WRONG?!?!

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Ah, you still want to argue your same old argument. There’s nothing wrong with owning guns. I’m sorry you feel there is. You keep saying “who needs this, that or the other for home defense” “his mother collected them, five so far, five guns” do you have a specific number of guns that one should own legally in mind? You have no clue what constitutes an “arsenal” of guns.

          • salvagesalvage

            Nothing wrong with owning a gun, you mean like if someone takes those guns and shoots up a school? Nothing wrong there!

            Yes, NONE but if you really live in such a state of fear that you cannot sleep unless you have a gun, then a single shot pistol with a 9 bullet clip is more than enough after you’ve been trained, certified, back-ground checked, the gun is “finer-printed” and you keep it in a safe that only the adults have the combo to.

            I know, I know FREEEEDDDDDOOOOOM! is why Americans should own as many guns they like with unlimited fire power.

            Who cares how many tiny coffins it fills? FREEEEEEDOOOOOMMMM!

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            You’re frustration is starting to show now. You’re lack of a logical argument is starting to show. You’re lack of education regarding gun ownership and ammunition is really starting to show now.

          • salvagesalvage

            Ha! Ha! Yes! I know nothing about gun ownership save that people own guns and that those guns far more often than not kill innocent people.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            That doesn’t equate to knowledge of gun ownership and the process to legally own a gun. I’m sorry that you don’t feel the need to educate yourself on subjects you desperately want to argue against. Knowledge really is a powerful thing and it would add to your arguments greatly.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Maybe this will help you. It’s called a “HOMICIDE” because it’s a PERSON killing another PERSON. The gun can’t kill anyone. I honestly can’t understand why can’t the self-proclaimed intelligentsia on the lunatic, panic-stricken left figure out the basic vocabulary of the issue?

          • salvagesalvage

            Guns make it very easy to kill people, again try to shoot someone without one.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Correct. So when someone is threatening your life, you will be very happy that the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution allows you to have your _______________ (<— insert your firearm of choice here) readily accessible so you can kill them instead of them killing you, your wife, your daughter, your son, etc.

            You're starting to catch one, SS. We're proud of you!!!

            Gold Star!!!!!

          • salvagesalvage

            Well I don’t like in America so the 2nd Amendment doesn’t apply yet we can get guns, in fact if I really wanted I could have a concealed weapon, a shot gun or rifle even automatic weapons.

            But I don’t live the state of fear and loathing that wingnuts seem to thrive in so I have no need.

            Oh and a good sized dog is a far more effective “weapon” in home defense than your guns which are more likely to be used against your family than any bad guy.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Perhaps it’s less sinister than you think. Perhaps it’s not that we are “wingnuts” (whatever that is) as much as you are just lucky enough to live in a more tranquil, less violent setting than others are.

            And I do have a dog. A great, big 75 lbs. one, and when I was attacked and savagely stabbed at my house that day, he took a good chunk out of one of their sides. But, helass, the beast hath no thumbs and is therefore quite inept with a firearm. So I shot them. It worked out well for all of us.

          • salvagesalvage

            Well I don’t like in America so the 2nd Amendment doesn’t apply yet we can get guns, in fact if I really wanted I could have a concealed weapon, a shot gun or rifle even automatic weapons.

            But I don’t live the state of fear and loathing that wingnuts seem to thrive in so I have no need.

            Oh and a good sized dog is a far more effective “weapon” in home defense than your guns which are more likely to be used against your family than any bad guy.

          • salvagesalvage

            Guns make it very easy to kill people, again try to shoot someone without one.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Most of your references are an analysis done by Richard Florida after the mass shootings in AZ. He made a point to state that correlation did not imply causation. He also stated this in his opinion that you’re referencing. ” Note that these figures include accidental shootings, suicides, even acts of self-defense, as well as crimes”.

          • salvagesalvage

            Sure but in the case of “places with more guns have more people being shot the causation is more than casual. Again, try shooting someone without a gun, it’s tricky at best.

            Oh, so accidental shootings and suicides, they’re all right are they? A small price to pay for the feeling of power your gun gives you?

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            I take it you’re like a few other liberal posters on here that I’ve debated. You really don’t like it when someone points out your arguments aren’t adding up or they are nothing more than repeated scare tactics for the uneducated. You’re arguments are trivial at best and I’ve never said that accidental shootings and suicides are “all right” or a small price to pay to own a gun legally. Contrary to what you may envision I don’t need a gun to feel powerful.

          • salvagesalvage

            Ha! Ha! Yes! Scare tactics! There is nothing to be worried about when your neighbour is a well armed malitia! Not like their crazy kid can take the guns and go on over to the local school and shoot it up!

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Please come up with a better argument. Right now you’re reminding me of a child who hasn’t gotten his way. But, but, but….You are using scare tactics created by the uninformed who want to create hysteria among the masses. You have no idea what a militia is so again enough with the scare tactics and hysteria.

          • salvagesalvage

            Ha! Ha! Yes! It’s scare tactics and hysteria to suggest that a lunatic can get his hands on multiple weapons and shoot up a school. NEVER COULD HAPPEN.

            Smarter wingnuts please!

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            Yep, scare tactics are a great defense against a lack of knowledge. And the name calling is fabulous I might add.

          • salvagesalvage

            Yes! It’s a scare tactic to suggest that guns are deadly and kill people!

            Calling wingnuts wingnuts is not an insult but a statement of fact.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            You really don’t have an educated argument to offer do you? I never said your name calling was an insult, I find it quite infantile myself and it’s nothing more than a diversionary tactic used by those who want to avoid answering direct questions and offering logical opinions as opposed to scare tactics and hysteria about a subject.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            At this sophistry and statistical wrangling is really really interesting and informative (not really; just being nice), but here’s the only stat that I really care about:

            On July 3, 2006 I walked in on a burglary at my residence. I was jumped from behind and savagely stabbed 6 times (once in the left upper chest) before I finally drew my Glock and got seven rounds off before they cleared out of my house. One was apprehended when he showed up the ER (while I was down the hall in a seven hour surgery to fix my chest and reattach all the severed nerves and musculotendinous junctions in my left arm). The other two were arrested the following day.

            Bottom line: In the parallel universe of gun control advocates I died at 1:34 p,m, on July 3, 2006.

            Your takeaway: You’re dead wrong about gun control.

            P.S. I’ll send you the ER pics taken of me that day by detectives if you want.

          • salvagesalvage

            And for every story like that there are dozens like this:

            Man accidently shot during gun-for-tires trade

            Boy, 4, Accidently Shoots Himself in the Head

            HUNTER HIT: Father Accidently Shoots Son | WHOTV.com – Des …

            Friend Accidently Shot

            And of course the lunatic from this week.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            So let’s boil that down to the differences between me and “them”.I’ve high quality training in the appropriate use of defensive handgun tactics. Again, and as has been said so many times (though it’s arguable whether some ever listen), it’s not the gun. It’s the person holding it. Just as my training, skill, and comfort with a sidearm determines my own outcome so, too, does the training and skill, or lack thereof, determine the contrasting outcomes you mention above.

            With respect to the clown de jour, he had training and skill, whether formal or informal, no doubt about it. The fly in the ointment in his instance, and most other clowns, is bad intent. Good luck coming up with a litmus test for that.

            Bottom line is that the legal, registered owner of those firearms didn’t commit a crime with those weapons. Someone to whom they were not registered and arguably should have never had access to them did. That fact doesn’t change or soften the outcome, but it puts this instance under the same light as all other illegal gun activities and brings the more seminal question front-and-center: How do you stop ill-intending people from illegally acquiring a firearm and committing a heinous crime with it?

            If you think the solution is to ban the trained, competent, legally possessing and law-abiding gun owners from having firearms, you had better be ready to hand over your knives, scissors, ice picks, automobiles, hammers, axes, machetes, etc. to the government. After that, ground the airlines, stop the trains, and park all the buses.

            It pains me say it but I agree that the ability of a citizen, trained or not, to possess a military-style assault rifle capable of firing 30+ rounds per quick-load magazine is unnecessary and a stretch to justify as a “defensive” or “hunting” arm unless five-headed-brain-eating-mutant-ninja-zombie-body-snatchers are a problem in your particular neighborhood. But I am very concerned about how to limit the authority to seize those weapons as it is a slippery ride down the slope of curtailing personal freedoms when you, I, or anyone else becomes the golden soul who decides where to parse the rights and freedoms guaranteed under the Constitution. And I do not include semi-automatic pistols in that statement as I am alive today because I had one and I can’t change that undeniable fact.

            Personally, I think the solution to this, as in other complex issues, lies in the successful formation and implementation of a multi-faceted solution.

            First, I think there needs to be a much more stringent training requirement in order to own, possess, and carry any firearm. I live in a “shall issue” state and have owned handguns since I was 21. However, I didn’t know how large the gap between what I knew and what I didn’t know was until I decided to get professionally trained in handgun tactics about 10 years ago. I have always been cautious and responsible with weapons, but the added dimensions of confidence, skill, and comfort in knowing that I not only know how to use my weapon, but also when (both practically and legally) is enormous.

            Second, I think, there has to be a better method for background checks. The current system is good as far as criminal history is concerned. But I think it fails dismally where mental health history is concerned, and it seems in this age of electronic health records and the unfathomable amount of money being spent on health care in this country, someone, somewhere ought to be able to cull mental health indicators from the myriad of medical digital data warehouses. This too, however, doesn’t address those who are as nutty as a PBJ but never get diagnosed or treated.

            Third, average citizens need to start taking responsibility for each other. If the gun owner down the road starts to inexplicably change his demeanor, attitude, or behavior for the worse, call a cop for Christ’s sake. Similarly, if the well-known emo, drug popping, recluse, skinhead, assclown down the road suddenly starts showing up a firing range, call a cop. The worst thing that will happen is you bring some undeserved attention to a fellow citizen who turns out to be more “normal” than you are. The best thing that can happen is you stop another Columbine, Virginia Tech, Newtown from happening. And I know that calm, level-headed, non-agenda driving thinkers who are smarter than I am have similar and better ideas, and I’d love to hear them.

            But in all of this I’m ever mindful, and I would encourage others to be as well, of what freedom and liberty have proclaimed incessantly throughout the history of this great Republic: Don’t tread on me.

          • salvagesalvage

            Bottom line is that the legal, registered owner of those firearms didn’t commit a crime with those weapons.

            No, her son did.

            Tell me why anyone needs five paramilitary level weapons? Do you really live in that much fear?

            Fact a gun is made to kill a human, in a rare instance that killing could be justified but the VAST majority of the time the victims are innocent people.

            You need a gun for hunting, for defense, fine, a rifle or other single shot pistol is more than enough.

            But it doesn’t matter, it’s too late, even if America enacted some sane gun control it’s all too far gone, the NRA has be superb in their tactics.

            Your children will be gunned down in schools, in parking lots, in their homes forever and ever. Enjoy!

          • JustLikeAnimals

            The fallacy of your premise of single shot arms is that it assumes a foe who is equally disarmed, and you and I both know that is not going to happen. You win a fight with equally matched or superior firepower. You don’t bring a knife to a gunfight, and you certainly better not break our your trusty single shot .410 ga. shotgun when the scumbag crawling through your daughter’s bedroom window has a semi-automatic pistol. If you do, you’ll be sorry. Then you’ll be dead, and so will your daughter, after the scumbag does whatever it is he wants to her first.

            Do I live in fear of that? Absolutely. Am I more than prepared to defend her, my wife, and myself against that scumbag. Absolutely. Both in terms of legally having the appropriate weapon for the task, and in my knowledge, skill, confidence, and comfort in using it.

            FYI, I don’t hunt. Don’t need to. Don’t want to. And, if you read my treatise above more carefully, you’d know that I agree that assault rifles should simply not be available outside of federally controlled military and para-miltary circles. I am a reasonable man and I can’t imagine the need to shoot at anything or anybody 30 times. If you can’t stop an attacker/intruder with a 13 or 15 shot semi-auto pistol, you need some professional training. You should be able to draw your sidearm from a concealed holster and place two shots in between an attacker’s eyes and his nose in 1.5 seconds. And if you can’t, you’re in serious trouble and you are not prepared to successfully defend yourself, no matter what weapon you possess. And trust me, two shots in the face is all you need.

            So I again say the assault rifles and 30 round mags are excessive and can be dispensed with tomorrow as far as I’m concerned. A properly trained shooter with good situational awareness and the right defensive mindset can easily subdue multiple attackers with a semi-automatic pistol with a standard 13 or 15 shot magazine. And if you can’t, get trained.

            And you’re right. If America enacted some insane disarmament gun law tomorrow, I would report my weapon stolen the next day.

            So let’s drop the knee-jerk panic to ban firearms from the hands of competent, legally possessing individuals, and being a more calm, level-headed, realistic dialogue about how to better identify who should not have them and how to come together at a community-level to make that happen. The biggest problem I see is people don’t know or care about their neighbors anymore. We’re socially disconnected from one another that even when we notice something out of the norm with one of our fellow citizens, we adopt a “live and let live” mentality and walk on down the road. Someone saw something with this kid (notice how many people who knew him keep saying “I’m not surprised”)? What I find surprising is that people apparently knew the mom was hoarding arms and ammunition, and that the kid was a nutjob, but none of them, not a one, thought to drop a dime and call a cop and say, “Hey, do you guys think it’s a good idea for her to have that many weapons, legal or not, with such an out of control kid in the house”? A phone call, just one, could have change the course of history. But we won’t do it because we live in a time when community is not a priority and our every focus is on us, me, and I, and “they” aren’t my problem,

            Until they show up at your house, or your kid’s school, and then they become everybody’s problem.

            So if you want to preach something to the point of having an effect and doing something good, go next door and knock on your neighbors door and have that conversation tonight. And get them to do the same. Then you’ll be engaging in a meaningful discourse that has some realistic chance of changing something. But you and I both know that criminals and ill-intending sickos do not give a good god damn about what gun control laws you pass because they have no intention of following them in the first place. You’re only disarming potential victims and making them more readily accessible to the whacked out sicko scumbags that intend to do them harm, and how you fail to see that or somehow find it acceptable is quite disturbing and speaks volumes of how thoughtless you and the rest of the out-of-control, lock-step, lunatic, left has become.

          • salvagesalvage

            SHhh, I get it, you love your guns and you can’t wait to shoot someone. I understand that to maintain this fantasy you don’t care how many crazy people massacre children. Your fear trumps their safety.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            You really don’t have an educated response to someone who suggested how you could make your arguments useful in your direct community do you? Engaging in meaningful debates and offering up ideas to help a situation isn’t your strong suite is it?

          • salvagesalvage

            Yeah, there’s nothing to debate, guns are tools to kill people, for some weird reason wingnuts think they’re toys or “collectibles” which is what adults call their toys.

            There’s also nothing to debate because the wingnuts won this some 30 years ago, America will for the next hundred years have all kinds of crazy guns that crazy people can get to shoot up theatres, school yards, political gatherings and all other target rich environments.

          • salvagesalvage

            SHhh, I get it, you love your guns and you can’t wait to shoot someone. I understand that to maintain this fantasy you don’t care how many crazy people massacre children. Your fear trumps their safety.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            At this sophistry and statistical wrangling is really really interesting and informative (not really; just being nice), but here’s the only stat that I really care about:

            On July 3, 2006 I walked in on a burglary at my residence. I was jumped from behind and savagely stabbed 6 times (once in the left upper chest) before I finally drew my Glock and got seven rounds off before they cleared out of my house. One was apprehended when he showed up the ER (while I was down the hall in a seven hour surgery to fix my chest and reattach all the severed nerves and musculotendinous junctions in my left arm). The other two were arrested the following day.

            Bottom line: In the parallel universe of gun control advocates I died at 1:34 p,m, on July 3, 2006.

            Your takeaway: You’re dead wrong about gun control.

            P.S. I’ll send you the ER pics taken of me that day by detectives if you want.

          • salvagesalvage
          • AMSilver
          • salvagesalvage

            Yeah, National Review, that’s a source just like Harvard! What does the NRA say?!?!

          • $23901791

            The NRO post was in response to your WAPO post. Don’t dance around the argument. NRO is every bit as legitimate as WAPO.

          • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

            Yeah, and the Washington Post is Macaca.

          • $23901791

            Those “facts” show that violent crime happened LESS often in the past when there was LESS gun control. Try again.

          • salvagesalvage

            1. Where there are more guns there is more homicide (literature review)

            CAN YOU READ?

            http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/research/hicrc/firearms-research/guns-and-death/index.html

          • $23901791

            There is no correlating data shown to back up the claim. Just because it is Harvard that says so does not make it so. I need the data.

          • $23901791

            What you need to do is review data:

            http://www.smallarmssurvey.org/publications/by-type/yearbook/small-arms-survey-2007.html

            Correlate it with another set of data:

            http://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/statistics/crime/Homicide_statistics2012.xls

            And draw your own conclusion instead of just absorbing the talking points of others.

          • $23901791

            Actually…I found this.

            http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronline.pdf

            “Rather, if firearms availability does matter, the data consistently show that the way it matters is that more guns equal less violent crimes.”

          • salvagesalvage

            And that’s why America that has tons of guns is at the bottom of the world wide list for gun violence!

            Oh, no, wait.

          • $23901791

            Not at the bottom, but nowhere near the top. However, the U.S. IS the number one in gun ownership. Second is a DISTANT second. Again, the U.S. is NOWHERE NEAR the top in violent crime.

            Of the ten states that have above 50% gun ownership, 5 (South Dakota, Wyoming, Montana, North Dakota, Idaho) are in the top ten safest states, while 1 (Alaska) is in the top ten least safe states. Of the 11 states that are below 30% gun ownership, 1 (Rhode Island) is in the top ten safest states and 3 (Delaware, Maryland, Florida) are in the top ten least safe.

            Oh, and btw, CAN YOU READ?

            That would be uncalled for EXCEPT how you kept repeating a source that didn’t quite prove what you thought it did (it had no correlating data) while shouting CAN YOUR READ to me, every single time.

            So, I listed a source (from the SAME UNIVERSITY) that actually has data and evidence with it that supports my theory and not yours.

          • salvagesalvage
          • $23901791

            You keep limiting it to “firearm violence”. What else are you going to commit firearm violence with? A spoon? Stick with violent crime in a general sense. Reducing gun availability will reduce firearm violence the same way reducing chairs will reduce “chair-related accidents”. This does not mean that fewer chairs leads to fewer accidents, since the clumsy morons will just find something else to trip over or stand on while trying to stick a screwdriver in a light socket. The evil SOBs murdering people with guns will just find knives/boards/rocks/severed limbs/boots/icepicks/glowsticks/wires/dogs/video game controller cords/glass/snapping turtles/etc to murder people with. In overall violent crime…the U.S. is about 85th out of about 150. Not the safest in the world, no doubt, but nowhere near the most dangerous.

            And it contradicts with the rest of your narrative, besides. When you ask if it is easier to kill with guns, you are implying that the presence of guns will make ALL violence increase, not just firearm-related violence.

          • salvagesalvage

            Once again, try and shoot someone without a gun, it’s really quite hard.

            Guns are tools with one purpose; to kill people the idea that their access should be carefully limited is neither foolish nor impractical. There is more gun violence in places with more guns there is less gun violence in places with less guns.

            It’s so simple that even a wingnut should understand it but ME LUV GUN!! so they don’t even try.

            But like I said, it doesn’t matter, you won! You will always have plenty of guns to aid in your security and there will always be massacres like this.

          • $23901791

            And yet, there is typically less violence, in general, in areas with more guns. Not always, I admit. It is more likely that guns have little or nothing to do with overall violence. What little effect there is is usually positive.

            And, again, you make the strange claim that guns are more often the preferred tool to commit violence when violence does occur in areas of greater gun availability. That is true. What you leave out is that this is REPLACING other weapons used for these crimes, not creating new crimes out of thin air.

            What you are also leaving out is that when there is LOW availability, criminals still get guns on the black market and, then, guns only go into the hands of criminals. They are only an “equalizer” if law abiding citizens have the right to carry them.

            And, yes, I have won. My side has, anyway. We WILL always have guns. And massacres like this will ONLY continue to occur as long as these places remain “gun free zones” where only the people who DON’T follow the rules will be armed. The teachers don’t even have to be armed. Just start placing some armed guards in the schools. That won’t prevent the shootings, but it will reduce the death toll.

            And, btw, it is NOT that hard to shoot someone without a gun. Try a bow, crossbow, nailgun, homemade “guns” like “potatoe guns” (in quotes because they are more like a shaped shrapnel charge than an actual gun.)

          • salvagesalvage

            Yeah how many mass murders with guns have there been in the States compared to the rest of the world?

            Ha! Ha! Yes! More guns means less shooting! Hard to argue with logic like that.

          • salvagesalvage
          • salvagesalvage

            And that’s why America that has tons of guns is at the bottom of the world wide list for gun violence!

            Oh, no, wait.

          • $23901791

            BTW, you call me wingnut when the closest thing you’ve listed to an actual fact is a blog post full of inconsistencies and misrepresentations. The rest of your responses have been emotional arguments and ad hominem.

        • Finrod Felagund

          For every complex problem, there is a simple, easy-to-understand wrong answer. Congratulations, you found it.

        • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

          Guns make killing easier from a distance. That is the reason I keep them in my house and carry one in public.

          Ever wonder why concealed carry folks rarely stop a mass shooter? Because the cowardly shooters go to gun-free zones to commit their evil. Most concealed carry folks are law abiding and don’t violate gun-free zones.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            Sorry, I ccw and I quietly violate “gun-free” zones all the time. Mostly because I know some crazed, whacked out retard with a gun doesn’t give a good goddamn about the “gun-free” designation, and I refuse to give myself, my wife, or my daughter up to that potential outcome.

          • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

            Same here in most instances. A violation in Virginia, other than gubmint buildings is a trespassing violation.

          • Finrod Felagund

            The only reason the shooter at the mall in Oregon didn’t kill more people was because there was a concealed carry person there:

            http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html

          • Finrod Felagund

            The only reason the shooter at the mall in Oregon didn’t kill more people was because there was a concealed carry person there:

            http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html

        • SDN

          Does stupidity hurt? It should.

        • JustLikeAnimals

          Simple answer: My CCW Glock makes it harder for someone who intends to kill me and sooooooo much easier for me to kill them.

          Me likey-likey! =).

          • salvagesalvage

            Ah, thank you, yes, this is the exact sort of wingnut I’m talking about, the paranoid full of fear clutching their toy longing for the day they can go Hollywood with it.

            You’re more likely to shoot yourself or a family member or have it stolen by someone who will also use it.

          • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.dean.564 Lisa Dean

            I just love your juvenile, over used, chicken little assumptions about gun owners, their guns and their families.

          • salvagesalvage

            AHAHAH! Yes! It’s completely hysterical to suggest crazy people could do horrible things with guns. IT JUST NEVER HAPPENS!

          • salvagesalvage

            Just read your story, you did get to shoot a bad guy! Congrats! For every bad guy killed how many good ones are?

        • Karl H

          Don’t know my guns have never killed a person. Obamas sleeping habits have killed 4 people that we know of. So are you going to ask anymore irrelevant questions?

          • salvagesalvage

            HAHAHAH! Yes! Obama actually planned the consulate attack because he is a Muslim who hates America and he ordered all Marines in the Middle East to empty their weapons of ammo and stand down so the Muslim Brotherhood can take over!

          • Karl H

            So when the leftist achieve the power they seek what degenerate group do you belong to that will identify you as an enemy of the state?
            Are you just the run of the mill agent provacateur? or is there a more sinister evil in your background?

            Remember History does not just repeat itself, it repeats itself in very precise and painful detail.

            Learn the history of leftism and the tactics used to gain power and control. Ask yourself exactly where you fit in with the leftist power structure. I can tell you where people like the OWS movement fit in, right at the bottom of a mass grave, same with the protest leaders and the rable rousing writers as well as the agent provacateurs.

        • Karl H

          Don’t know my guns have never killed a person. Obamas sleeping habits have killed 4 people that we know of. So are you going to ask anymore irrelevant questions?

    • LordElrond09

      Ridiculous argument. The cities with the strictest gun control laws have the highest crime rates. Check out rape rates in Australia and Canada to see how well gun control works for the average women. Talk about a ‘war on women’. Here’s a hint, they don’t.

      And no children don’t die so we can ‘feel secure’. Children die in this country for MANY reasons. Are you as worried about child abuse, MVA’s, accidents, blah blah blah? Or is your solution one of typical liberalism, throw money at the problem?

      The surge worked in Iraq and you libs fail to acknowledge it. So maybe we need a ‘surge’ in gun ownership, starting with teachers who want to carry.

      It’s you liberals killing children by disarming responsible adults all over the country with your useless gun laws that clearly criminals do not obey.

      • salvagesalvage

        Rape rates? AHAHAH! YES! MORE GUNS = LESS RAPE.

        And how many gun rampages in schools has Canada had in the last 30 years? How many in America?

        And Iraq is a garden paradise of peace and Democracy!

        http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/2/8/60558/World/Region/Two-bombings-kill–in-Iraq.aspx

        They also found all the WMD and GW Bush is the most popular President ever and Romney won in a landslide!

        Ahh thank wingnut for once again showing just how immune to reality you are.

        • Finrod Felagund

          Syria is making Sarin gas RIGHT NOW using the WMDs that were shipped there from Iraq before the US invasion, numbnuts.

        • Rabid

          as far as rape goes …apparently you don’t have a daughter

          • Finrod Felagund

            I dearly hope that troll hasn’t procreated.

    • Rabid
    • SDN

      You are a liar.

    • Karl H

      Thousands dead in Mexico because Obama and Holder are running guns to drug cartels not a damn peep from liberal Democrats and now suddenly you want to talk gun control?

      Stop dancing in the blood of children you sick ignorant idiot.

      • salvagesalvage

        AHAHHAH! YES! I love this whole “Fast and Furious” thing, when wingnuts suddenly care about people (Mexican people!) being shot.

        And yes! Obama sells guns to drug cartels because he is a secret Muslim who hates America and loves drug cartels.

        Good thing Romney won the election in that landslide!

        • lainer51

          wow, you finally got it right – your 2nd paragraph is the first truthful thing you have said!

        • Karl H

          Do they take you off the meds before you go on the internet or is this how you are with the meds?

          Lets stick to what I did say and not what the voices in your empty head heard.

          I said that Obama like most liberal idiots creates situations that lead to crisis in order to further his agenda. Ie. Giving drug cartels weapons to increase violence. Or supplying military weapons to Al Queda in Libya. Or providing advanced weapons platform aircraft to the muslim brotherhood. Or keeping dossiers on American civilians that have not been accused or even suspected of crimes.

          Funny these are all things I am sure you would hate Bush for but since it is a leftwing socialist you just look the other way.

          500 million people were killed in the last 100 years during peacetime, not war so that leftists could further their agendas. In the words of your President, just bumps in the road. I am not liberal and not latino or black so he is not my president, If I recall correctly Obama has already Identified me to Latinos as “the enemy” and told his base to come after me with a gun and get in my face. SO I am pretty sure I am justified in my certainty that he is not my president, I am just an enemy of the state awaiting executive orders to have me executed without trial since he also established that American citizens do not need a trial to be executed under orders of the president.

          New flash, you are not an elitist, If you were you would be riding in the front of AF1 having drinks with Obama and Soros. You are a useful idiot and when leftist finally get the power they want they exterminate the degenerates that helped them accomplish their goals. That is how the program works, The gay rights activists, the criminal elements like the union thugs or the gangster rappers, all of them are just fodder for the power.

          It was that way and always will be that way from the very start, if it was Karl Mark and the revolution or Adolf Hitler and the socialist uprising in Germany, Fidel Castro and Cuba it always ends the same the useful idiots are the very first to go.

          So what will you choose? Detainment in Gitmo followed by just disappearing? Being declared an enemy of the state and shot down like a dog in front of your friends and family? Hell maybe just a drive by… That is what you support and that is what you are.

          You are a useful idiot who when not playing in his own excrement is dancing in the blood of innocent victims.

    • Karl H

      Thousands dead in Mexico because Obama and Holder are running guns to drug cartels not a damn peep from liberal Democrats and now suddenly you want to talk gun control?

      Stop dancing in the blood of children you sick ignorant idiot.

  • CombatDiver

    So glad I picked up my Noveske Afghan today. God bless America and god bless the 2nd Amendment and thank god I have the right to carry concealed ( Kimber ultra CDP 2)

    • JustLikeAnimals

      Me, too. CCW Glock 23 (Gen 4) .40 cal S&W in a Comp-Tac Minotaur MTAC IWB.
      It’s like a little green credit card: I don’t leave home without it!

      • Ken Alan Draper

        I don’t have a permit, why let the gov. know exactly where to go to confiscate. you’ve voluntarily put yourself on a government blacklist. bad enough I have to go through a background check to buy a firearm, I don’t believe they really erase all record of the check like they are suppost to.

        • CombatDiver

          Typically I would agree with you, but if I have a firearms violation, then I will no longer be allowed to perform my job for the military and I doubt siting the 2nd amendment to an officer of the law as to why I am carrying, will be my get out of jail free card after I canoe somebody’s head.

          • JustLikeAnimals

            The Great State of Louisiana only requires a permit for concealed carry. Open carry and in-home possession is no-permit required. =)

      • CombatDiver

        Nice. For an early CHRISTmas gift, I gave my wife a Gen 4 G26 with Ameriglo Operator Night sights, trigger job, match barrel and a few other goodies. If I didn’t have my kimber for daily carry, it would without a doubt be a Glock.

  • kch50428

    ‘Thinking’ man David Frum – There’s an oxymoron if I ever saw one – even with ‘Thinking’ in quotes…

    • Finrod Felagund

      If a brain slug was attached to his head, it would starve.

  • $35072932

    CBNNews.com – JERUSALEM, Israel – One Israeli was killed and six others injured Thursday evening in two separate terrorist attacks in the Jerusalem area.
    http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/310078.aspx

    Two Palestinian terrorists disguised in Israel Defense Forces (IDF) uniforms entered the study hall at Makor Haim High School in Kibbutz Kfar Etzion southeast of Jerusalem.

    Armed with guns and knives, the terrorists managed to stab several students before armed school counselors arrived and shot them dead.

    Time for knife control.

    • JustLikeAnimals

      “armed school counselors arrived and shot them dead.”

      More pointedly, time to arm teachers and counselors!!! Reality is that a semi-automatic pistol in the trained hands of one of those adults in that office would have ended this massacre before it got started, and those kids would be home warm in their beds tonight. Two taps in the OC cavity (which anyone can be trained to do) and this clown would have dropped like a rock.

      Check this out…..

      http://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sight.com/2012/12/14/front-sight-special-blog-when-will-we-wake-up/

      • Ken Alan Draper

        If they did that they’d have to check teachers mental health before issueing them weapons, that would eliminate a lot of the current teachers, who have proven themselves to be crazy.

        • http://www.facebook.com/julielandlgutierrez Julie Landl Gutierrez

          I would hope they are checking teachers mental health anyhow!!!

  • TRONRADIO

    David Frum: A boorish, little man with a little mind and a microscopic heart–if one at all. Amazing he is employed anywhere.

  • BeeKaaay

    Switzerland has mandatory gun ownership. Crime rate is 1/10 of here.

  • http://boogieforward.us/ K-Bob

    Fellow Moron at AoSHQ, RWC, has pointed out that this form of douchebaggery is called “blood dancing.”

    Frum, Michael Moore, Piers Morgan and all the Usual Suspects are dancing on the blood of these children.

  • http://www.lidsamy.com/ Lidsamy

    I just threw up a little in my mouth

  • Janna

    This is a time for mourning, contemplation, and grieving. Not the time to act like a scumbag. Shut up Mr. Frum. We get it, you’re trying to use this situation to further your ideas about gun control. Where is your compassion, your heart? This is not the time or the place for propagating an agenda. I’m sure he’s just one of many doing so on twitter right now as we speak.

    • Ken Alan Draper

      People like frum have no soul, they have no consideration for others, they truely believe that they are better then most & all the rest of us are here for them to use as they please. the media & government are full of these self-absorbed, nonthinking nitwits. that’s why so many people are preparing to defend themselves from their government. having people like this in power always leads to a murderous totalitarian regime.

  • $35072932

    Clackamas man, armed, confronts mall shooter
    http://www.nwcn.com/news/oregon/183609901.html

    PORTLAND, Ore … Nick Meli is emotionally drained. The 22-year-old was at Clackamas Town Center with a friend and her baby when a masked man opened fire.

    The friend and baby hit the floor. Meli, who has a concealed carry permit, positioned himself behind a pillar.

    The break in gunfire allowed Meli to pull out his own gun, but he never took his eyes off the shooter.

    “As I was going down to pull I saw someone in the back of the charlotte move and I knew if I fired and missed I could hit them.”

    “I’m not beating myself up cause I didn’t shoot him,” said Meli. “I know after he saw me I think the last shot he fired was the one he used on himself.”

    Clackamas Mall Shooter Was Confonted By Concealed Carrier (Oregon)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD52IxplEoM&feature=player_detailpage

  • http://twitter.com/l4issez Conservative First

    Aside from all the fail in every argument he attempted to make, I want to focus on one:

    “And if the reason you want semi-automatics is because you imagine bearing arms against the govt, I ask: why do you hate America?”

    A vast majority of weapons in America are semi-automatic, so I’m going to guess he doesn’t know what a semi-automatic weapon is (i.e. my Glock 17 that sits next to me). The point of so may weapons in the hands of the people is to put fear in the government of attempting to rise up against it’s people has HAS BEEN SEEN MANY TIMES OVER AND OVER AGAIN IN HISTORY. The first order of every mass murderer (in the 10’s or 100’s of millions) despot has been to take the guns from the hands of the citizens to quell any attempts at uprising. David Frum, you my friend (said very loosely) are an idiot.

  • http://twitter.com/l4issez Conservative First

    Aside from all the fail in every argument he attempted to make, I want to focus on one:

    “And if the reason you want semi-automatics is because you imagine bearing arms against the govt, I ask: why do you hate America?”

    A vast majority of weapons in America are semi-automatic, so I’m going to guess he doesn’t know what a semi-automatic weapon is (i.e. my Glock 17 that sits next to me). The point of so may weapons in the hands of the people is to put fear in the government of attempting to rise up against it’s people has HAS BEEN SEEN MANY TIMES OVER AND OVER AGAIN IN HISTORY. The first order of every mass murderer (in the 10’s or 100’s of millions) despot has been to take the guns from the hands of the citizens to quell any attempts at uprising. David Frum, you my friend (said very loosely) are an idiot.

  • http://twitter.com/l4issez Conservative First

    As for Frum stating that there has been 1 instance of gun protection since 1982? This is beyond comprehension! There are stories all over the place of rape victims protecting themselves, and old people shooting burglars/home invasion robbers. I think David Frum failed at his quick Google search, and needs to take a Google-fu class.

    I would love to hear David Frum call up and debate Larry Elder (talk show in LA on KABC 790AM) on all his statements. Larry made a great movie called Michael & Me as an answer to Michael Moore’s Bowling for Columbine. And also wrote a nice column on Townhall “Yes Guns Kill, But How Often Are They Used In Self Defense?” : http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full/

    • Ken Alan Draper

      What about that attepted mass shooting at that church in colorado a few years ago. where the shooter was shot by a church member who was carrying concealed? funny how that one was quickly forgotton.

      • Karl H

        Actually I believe she was an armed security guard hired by the church, either way a civilian not police or other law enforcement. When seconds count the cops are just minutes away.

        Even the Department of Justice in 1994 (when democrats where in control) found the use of guns for defense and prevention of crime by citizens was about 1.5 million per year.

        When you remove the justifiable homicides, suicides and accidental shootings (not all of which result in death) then the actual criminal use of a firearm to commit a homicide makes guns less likely to be used to kill than hands or feet.

        Also remember that depending upon the state and they way they prosecute homicide you can further reduce that number. Plenty of people have been convicted of murder for defending persons or personal property on their own property for nothing more than they live in a “shall retreat” state. Ie their state laws requires a person to retreat from an aggressive criminal regardless of circumstance. So if a person breaks into your home with a gun and a prosecutor can prove that you had the opportunity to run out the back door and did not then you are guilty of murder. Those are all blue states, go figure.

  • http://twitter.com/l4issez Conservative First

    As for Frum stating that there has been 1 instance of gun protection since 1982? This is beyond comprehension! There are stories all over the place of rape victims protecting themselves, and old people shooting burglars/home invasion robbers. I think David Frum failed at his quick Google search, and needs to take a Google-fu class.

    I would love to hear David Frum call up and debate Larry Elder (talk show in LA on KABC 790AM) on all his statements. Larry made a great movie called Michael & Me as an answer to Michael Moore’s Bowling for Columbine. And also wrote a nice column on Townhall “Yes Guns Kill, But How Often Are They Used In Self Defense?” : http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full/

  • J.N. Ashby

    A German Shepard costs more than a gun in the long run, David.