Among those companies announcing layoffs this week was Ohio-based coal company Murray Energy, whose CEO Robert E. Murray gathered his staff for a prayer Wednesday before announcing more than 150 job cuts. Twitchy earlier reported on the tantrum thrown by liberals over news of mass layoffs this week, which they characterized as vile, petty, un-American and done “not for any legitimate reason” other than “revenge.”

Jim Manley, a long-time Democratic spokesman and former senior communications advisor to Sen. Majority Leader Harry Reid, added his voice to the mob by calling Murray’s prayer “grotesque” and his claim of a “so-called” war on coal phony and made up. Where would anyone have gotten such an outrageous idea in the first place? Perhaps from then-Senator Obama’s statement in 2008 that anyone building coal-fired plants would be bankrupted by fines for carbon gas emissions?

Murray’s prayer concluded:

Lord, please forgive me and anyone with me in Murray Energy Corp. for the decisions that we are now forced to make to preserve the very existence of any of the enterprises that you have helped us build. We ask for your guidance in this drastic time with the drastic decisions that will be made to have any hope of our survival as an American business enterprise.

We admit we know about as much about running an energy company as the people who ran Solyndra did, but apparently these people do, and they’re happy to judge Murray on his “cruel and inhumane” treatment of those for whom he provided employment for so many years.

https://twitter.com/dorybenami/status/267021832249548801

  • Guest

    forward.

  • don3ham

    Pure, ignorant hatred. Typical liberal.

  • http://www.facebook.com/denise.mcpherson.16 Denise McPherson

    Sometimes business decisions are tough. We had to close our business putting many people out of job.

  • digitalPimple

    forward

    • http://www.facebook.com/rob.phelps.ind Robert Phelps

      Shouldn’t that be FOWARD?

  • Heidi Cochran

    Bob Murray’s encouragement of the dangerous method of retreat mining directly contributed to the deaths of six miners and three rescuers in 2007. He repeatedly ignored safety concerns and denied responsibility for the disaster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crandall_Canyon_Mine I’m a conservative, but I am not Bob Murray’s biggest fan–I spent a good part of my childhood in Emery County and this one hit very close to home. However, as much as I despise his actions in 2007 (and during the aftermath), I can’t get behind people calling for his death.

    • Joe W.

      No one twisted the arms of those miners as I recall. I also recall that Mr. Murray took responsibility and was clearly emotionally invested in that tragedy. Its a tough business.

      • Heidi Cochran

        It’s a small blue collar farming community–there’s not much work out there. For a lot of these miners, it’s all they know and the only option they have. Friends who knew Bob Murray didn’t see the emotional investment–they saw someone who lied to them and tried to place blame elsewhere. Either way, it’s a sad thing and I hate the idea that more of them will be out of work now.

        • Joe W.

          Yep. And thanks to Oblamer, they have 150 less jobs, too.

          • Heidi Cochran

            People in cities might survive, but people in towns with populations less than 2000, who rely on farming, mining, and ranching, are going to be living in ghost towns in a few years.

          • Joe W.

            A few years????? You are an optimist….

          • Heidi Cochran

            Oh, I know. Huntington’s been on the brink for 20 years…

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            i don’t know know if “we in the city” will survive or not if jobs keep getting cut and we can’t find work.

          • http://www.theconservativevoices.com/ dmacleo

            or food and electricity coming from the rural areas.

  • Joe W.

    Liberals simply have to be the densest, most ill informed and vile creatures on god’s earth. But, Bless their little hearts, we must continue to pray for them. Difficult as it is…

    • KevinLawson

      We’ll make a deal with you. You don’t have to pray for us, and we don’t have to inform you about your grammar errors.

      • Joe W.

        What “grammar errors”, Shitforbrains?? And you have no choice. We’ll continue to pray for your sorry asses. In spite of your atheism.

        • CLCRichmond

          If Robert Murray is representative of your god, then i would certainly chose to be an atheist. Your the perfect example of the hatred and radicalism that has destroyed the Republican party but you are too damn stupid to see how stupid you are.

          • Joe W.

            “chose” should be CHOOSE; “damn” should be DAMNED; “i” should be capitalized; “your” should be YOU’RE; …..And you call ME stupid. Typical ignorant liberal moonbat. Thanks for plying, sonny.

          • Liberal Hater

            * you’re

          • Liberal Hater

            You also choose to be a dumbass. Congratulations!

          • SpinMeNot

            How is asking foregiveness for something that you have to do to ensure that some continue to have employment, when that act will inflict hard times on some hatred?

            I can’t afford to pay you, so I have to let you go. God teaches that if you cannot pay someone for their labor, then you cannot ask them for that labor.

            Wait, sorry, you are liberal. You don’t ask, you take.

            Not from me Junior.

      • http://twitter.com/thetugboatphil TugboatPhil

        How about this deal. If you don’t like the way electrical energy is produced, plug your iphone charging cord up you arse and get off the grid.

      • SpinMeNot

        Really, you are going to use contractions and then make snarky comments about grammar. For the record, you do not ever have to ask for my prayers. I pray daily for you and all your little developmentally challenged play-buddies.

    • CLCRichmond
      • SpinMeNot

        Oh nice, “take that mitches!” I’ll tell you what … you can post all the links you want to the art of manliness. Being a man is not an art. Being a man is about taking responsibility for yourself rather than the property of others.

        You are a cull of the herd. A weak man without sufficient moral fiber to realize just how pathetic you are.

    • Sol Robinson

      Please don’t. Your god has no effect on my life, and it is insulting that you think you get to convince the lord to personally change my opinions or the way i live my life.

      • Joe W.

        You have no choice, Scooter. I will pray for your soul regardless of your concerns. My God is the same as yours, even as you continue to reject him. It’s never too late, until it is, in fact, too late, pal. And that time is coming sooner than we may think. I pray you’ll figure it out, but if not, take your sunscreen & lotion with you. It’s pretty warm where y’all are headed.

      • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

        We’ll still pray for you. <3

        • Sol Robinson

          So you are going to trample my religious beliefs, by forcing your god into my life?

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            Your lot (Atheists) trample my religious beliefs everyday (see CHRISTmas for one example). What are you so afraid of? That there is a God out there? 😉 God Bless you.

          • Sol Robinson

            Excuse me?
            I’m Jewish. I don’t force my religion on people who don’t want it though, and I don’t use prayer as a means to insult someone.

          • Sol Robinson

            And Christmas is one day. 1. Not the entire month of December, so excuse me if I get a little tired of you shoving it in my face for 1/12 of the year.

  • http://www.facebook.com/maggie.dawdy Maggie Dawdy

    Yes, because businesses all over the world just love to go out of businesses because of spite. What fools these liberals be.

    • KevinLawson

      That’s right, the election had nothing to do with it. Burn baby burn!

      • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

        Apparently you either don’t have a job or don’t own a business. Until you achieve either of those two objectives, you really don’t have the whole picture. Boeing was paid off by the Obama Administration not to lay off workers until after the election. He doesn’t have to worry about re-election so he can do whatever he wants. Unemployment %s don’t matter anymore to him.

        • Tony Gamino

          wow. that’s one of the more hilarious conspiracy theories I’ve heard in a while. How’s life under that rock?

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            Every time one of you poor Ozombies yell “conspiracy theory” i get this mental pic in my head of Obama doing the Jedi mind trick on you and chanting. You are the living proof of conspiracy and succumbing to propaganda.

          • Cas

            read a news paper hon. This story is not new. This deal was made months ago.

          • Chris Jones

            Uh, no, not a conspiracy theory more like something that is well documented and has been reported on by nearly every major news organization in America.

            http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/10/at-white-house-request-lockheed-martin-drops-plan-to-issue-layoff-notices/

          • Kid Liberty

            Actually it’s true there fella. Obama justice department vowed to finance legal defense of companies that didn’t follow the law pertaining to notification of layoffs, rather encouraged them to wait until after the election before the mass layoff notifications were distributed. Then the house vowed to block any funding by the Obama administration attempting to reimburse companies who opted to break the law. And now that those people got their notifications the day after the election, the left blames the business owners and Republicans for all the layoffs “in response to the election”. Enjoy living in fantasy land Tony.

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            It’s the truth. Keep your head in the sand, it suits you, little Obamaphile.

      • SwTk

        Ass Hat. and – new fancy named little man. You are the fancy man. Dingus.

      • SpinMeNot

        The election had everything to do with it. We tried, we failed. An ignorant, Godless and selfish 50+% of this nation chose free stuff over freedom. So now there are consequences. Pass a law, increase what I have to spend for one employee to what I used to spend for two or more employees, and somebody is going to have to go. In this hypothetical example, as I own the business it isn’t going to be, and it isn’t going to be anybody that had the brains to vote with for character rather than color. Oh, sorry, I know you just bought that nice new car, and but that nice Obama/Biden sticker on it, but you will need to go the main conference room so that HR can start the layoff paperwork. You asked for more government, let me help you eat your own damn dog food.

        Go ahead say something else. I’ve just finished with one of you on another thread… I’m looking for fresh meat.

        • Ben Ulferd

          Well, considering that 70% of the republican voters in the 2008 election use entitlements provided by the government, perhaps your venom should be turned inward. Not sure if that’s a form of cannibalism or self-mutilation, but meat none the less.

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            that’s funny. Liberal women want to kill their own young and their “manly” men don’t want to have to take care of their own children without assistance from the rest of us. But we’re the cannibals.

          • Ben Ulferd

            ? are you drinking? try to keep up

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            i wish i was but sadly i have to cut back. Maybe you can get us all a drink with your foodstamps?

          • Judy B

            I don’t know a single Republican receiving any entitlement!

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            Provide some proof. Unemployment doesn’t count as it is provided by the former Employer.

        • http://twitter.com/mister8nine Emmanuel Stubbe

          you aren’t finished with me, as you failed to prove me wrong and I cornered you more than once 😉

          • SpinMeNot

            Where have you cornered me. Not one of your arguments has stood debunked. Yes, and the Europeans would be free nations without the US and England.

            More delusions.

          • Sol Robinson

            Oh.. so the UK is now not part of Europe?

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            wow you are deteriorating rapidly. were does this US/England comment come from? Besides, you are not worth it to re iterate all my arguments again, because even if your God would descend from “Heaven” or wherever he is, and tell you i’m right you would still not agree. You are impervious to reason, that’s maybe why you are religious. I have seen many believers who deny obvious points made to them. So i’m not gonna waste anymore time on you, I hope one day you’ll drop your self righteous arrogance and hate, I thought those were considered bad things in your religion

          • SpinMeNot

            Do you not remember WWII — it was the US and England that took your countries back from the Nazis and returned them to you. You really are a stupid little socialist aren’t you?

            My God would not descend from Heaven and tell me you are right. When my God does, as you say, then by definition you will have been proven wrong — you say He does not exist. If he does not exist, he can’t descend from Heaven. Did you learn anything at all about debate in school? Or is this what passes for high marks in Europe these days.

            I’ve not denied any obvious point you’ve made. I’ve shot down all the previous straw men you’ve thrown out and this latest lot.

            You really don’t see how poorly you argue any point, and I find that the saddest thing of all.

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            OHHHH there it is. Emmanuel is not just a “history buff” he’s an atheist. You know what all atheist have in common?? They don’t know shit about history. And they are always trying to tell Christians that they are “not Christian enough” poor thing is just lost in the weeds

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            you were wrong before you started typing. Do your own homework. You will never listen to us or anyone else that’s not a liberal. Hell, you won’t even open your mind to other possibilities of the truth before you try to pass it off as fact. You are not new or refreshing. Don’t you think these people have heard it before?? You are saying the same shit all you liberals say. Why don’t we agree?……because we think for ourselves and do our homework. Why don’t you try it?? That way when you have an informed opinion someone can discuss it with you.

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            They (Liberals) cannot see that they are the ones not open to listening, that they are the ones full of hatred and self-righteousness. But they have to blame it on someone, why not someone with a belief system? Perfect solution.

    • CLCRichmond

      Read this loser. Its how to lose with grace and dignity.

      http://artofmanliness.com/2011/08/19/lose-with-dignity-celebrate-with-grace-part-i/

      • Maria Seeger

        Exccuse me but why should we lose with grace and dignity when you all don’t win with grace and dignity? I mean when Beyonce says: “Take this, Mitches!” how is THAT winning with grace and dignity?
        Get real.

        • Tony Gamino

          Beyonce wasn’t running for office. She’s free to say what she wants. That’s what America is all about, right? How does her reaction compare with someone in Alabama that put an effigy of Obama on their lawn with a sign that says “pray for assassin.”

          • Chris Jones

            Ya, because we’re the hateful ones. LOL, don’t even try it, during the 2008 election people hung dolls resembling Sarah Palin, plus people on the left threatened to riot if Obama lost, not to mention Bill Maher saying black people would find us if we voted for Romney. Face it your side it completely morally and intellectually bankrupt. All you do is lash out in hate, and now your saying all the firing are a result of us taking revenge? Will you just wake up and learn something about economics already? Elections have consequences. Obama said he would bankrupt the coal industry, now your surprised the coal industry is being forced to fire people after you voted for him? Why are so surprised he did what he said he was going to do, why you even remotely surprised the entire economy is seeing mass firing? This is the consequence of a liberal president.

      • Christene

        Really? Then why all the cheating? Double voting, dead voting, fighting against voter ID,..is that your definition of a winner? This administration doesn’t know the first thing about winning, or doing it with grace,…from the Mr “I WON”.

        • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

          Don’t forget about the voting machines who registered a vote for Obama when it was actually supposed to be for Romney.

  • MyReality Bytes

    “war on coal phony and made up”????? – Basically, Obama said he was going to fine coal plants to the point of bankrupting them and “that will also generate BILLIONS of dollars that we can use to invest in solar, wind, biodiesel and other alternative energy approaches.” (We have seen how successful those investments in alternative energy sources have been so far…) YES! Obama did say he was going to bankrupt the coal industry. Video of these words actually coming out of Obama’s own mouth is here -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpTIhyMa-Nw&feature=related

    • Jack Deth

      Hi, MyReality:

      Thanks very much for the link!

  • Jack Deth

    Memo to Mr. Manley:

    In the words of Barack Obama:

    “You can have a coal or energy company.
    But you’ll go bankrupt!”

    Tell me again how Mr. Murray is being ‘grotesque’?

    The liberals and their media lapdogs are controlling the message for the foreseeable
    future. The next six moths are going to get real ugly. Real fast.

  • riddler1620

    Do liberals really think, as one tweet suggests, that firing employees should be made illegal? Do they not understand that there is that law of unintended consequences?

    • Just Another Guy

      That’s a good law…but these consequences were well know prior to the election.
      I know I told all my employees back in August that this would happen if Obama won.

      If Romney had won, I might have given him six months or so next year and see what would have happened. But with Obama and the Democrats still where they are….no way would I gamble.

      No point throwing good money away that will be wasted by the Feds.

    • Gusta

      I have no doubt that is EXACTLY what many liberals think and no doubt somewhere there is already a politician writing such a law.

    • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

      Another thing Liberals don’t realize is that most States are “right to work” States which means employers don’t even have to give a reason to fire someone.

      • http://www.theconservativevoices.com/ dmacleo

        right to work and at will are not the same thing.
        a state (like Maine) can be at will and not right to work.

        • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

          Here people can get fired for any reason legally, and the employer doesn’t have to say why.

          • http://www.theconservativevoices.com/ dmacleo

            same here unless its a union job.
            so basically if its a union shop you do not have the right to not join.
            my last company was bought out by union airline so we were forced into union or lose job since we were not right to work.
            for non-union jobs its an at will employment where you can be fired for anything as long as the actual employment laws not broken.
            so if you are rude to people you can be fired. employer does not have to give a reason, but they usually do as its safer to err on side of caution.

            unless you are union. then you can drive screwdrivers though aircraft on purpose with no repercussions..

          • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

            That’s why I don’t necessarily like unions.

  • Just Another Guy

    Hey, you guys “won” and this is a start of the consequences of that “win” on your part.

    Own it, jackwads. I close my business Dec 15 because it isn’t worth all the hassle that I’ll encounter in 2013 just to keep my business running.

    Me and my “pile of money” will do just fine. No taxes, either, since no investments that will cross that threshold into taxable income.

  • KevinLawson

    Global warming is great for windsurfing. Burn more coal and bring on the hurricanes!

    • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

      So what did we blame massive hurricanes on before we started using coal as much as we do now? Hmm. Weather patterns? But you know, have fun with your..hehe…global warming and such.

    • Zanshi

      And you wonder why we don’t tolerate progressives… DIAF!

  • Red Fred

    No, what’s grotesque is that old criminal Harry Reid presiding as the Senate Majority leader. That…is grotesque.

    • Bob S

      Amen to that point. What war? Duh–

    • Sol Robinson

      Not here for an argument, just here to get a list of wars that are and aren’t real

      Is this a correct list?
      War on women: no
      War on coal: yes
      War on religion: yes

      That it?

      • Liberal Hater

        War on Stupid LIberals Who Post on Twitchy: Yes.

        • Sol Robinson

          So that is a YES on “War on questions”

          • Southern fried

            War on liberal logic

      • SpinMeNot

        You left out war on white guys that pay taxes.

        • Sol Robinson

          Really? that’s your name for it?

          How about……

          “War on REAL Americans”

          That at least hides your self important racism.

          • http://www.facebook.com/rob.phelps.ind Robert Phelps

            The truth hurts doesn’t it? How many of those blacks who voted for Obama are living off the white people who pay taxes?

          • Sol Robinson

            Ok so adding
            “War on mooching black people” from the right.
            Check.

          • SpinMeNot

            No, war on mooches. It is your side that wants to worry about the amount and inflection of melatonin in the epidermis.

            Go ahead, I’ll wait for you to put more words in my mouth

          • Sol Robinson

            Did you not see this “The truth hurts doesn’t it? How many of those blacks who voted for Obama are living off the white people who pay taxes?”

            That is literally talking about black moochers. This wasn’t your mouth, it was the other guy. Who I responded to. Man dude, what happened to you?

          • SpinMeNot

            Nothing happened to me. I never said war on black mooches, nobody did. You try to stir shit up then dance around it. I’m a white guy talking about white guys getting screwed and being told we deserve it.

            I deserve to keep what I work for, not what somebody else things I deserve to keep.

          • Sol Robinson

            Ok, LITERALLY THIS:

            “The truth hurts doesn’t it? How many of those blacks who voted for Obama are living off the white people who pay taxes?”

            See how that says “Blacks who are living off white people”

            Do you not see that?

          • SpinMeNot

            No the truth doesn’t hurt me. The lack of truth hurts this country. You don’t get it. I said war on white guys that pay taxes. I said nothing about any other race — you leap to that conclusion.

            It is your side that believes people deserve better or worse treatment based on skin tone. Nobody deserves any special treatment of any kind for any reason other than they worked their asses off and earned that special treatment.

            But that would be fair now wouldn’t it and this isn’t about fair, its about theft of private property, under force of racially motivated law.

          • Sol Robinson

            No I am QUOTING SOMEONE

            that was on this page

            Just now

          • Sol Robinson

            Robert Phelps srobins6 • 25 minutes ago

            The truth hurts doesn’t it? How many of those blacks who voted for Obama are living off the white people who pay taxes?0

            •Reply•Share ›

          • SpinMeNot

            You really think that anybody here believes you aren’t a lying sack of crap, You said to me, above..

            srobins6 SpinMeNot • 37 minutes ago

            Really? that’s your name for it?

            How about……

            “War on REAL Americans”

            That at least hides your self important racism.
            —-

            That is what started this. You started this.

            Troll.

          • Sol Robinson

            When you were referring to “white people who pay taxes”

            You don’t see the inherent, self promoting racism of a statement like that?

          • Sol Robinson

            If it was “people who pay taxes” then that wouldn’t have been racist. But it wasn’t. It was WHITE PEOPLE.

          • SpinMeNot

            because that is what your side says. BHO started it, not us. If you use a word I’m going to use it.

            Black people call themself “Nigga”, but it if a white guy does it, that’s racist. A white guy says “war on white guys that pay taxes” and that is racist but a black person saying that white america this, or white america that isn’t,

            You can’t have it both ways. It doesn’t work that way. Sorry.

          • Southern fried

            oh yes because no one from the liberal progressive platform never injects raise into a comment. Get serious

          • Southern fried

            Well I guess when you say war on women then that is sexist. By your logic it is.

          • SpinMeNot

            No I don’t. There is nothing self promoting about it. BHO himself started the rich white guy stuff.

            You don’t understand that just because you are a coward that can’t think for themselves that most of us don’t give a crap what color of skin you happen to have. Only by the content of your character. We aren’t the ones that put on different tones and inflections when talking to an audience that happens to be black. That would be Joe Biden and Barrack H. Obama.

            I am so tired of you people being so arrogant in your intellects that you project your own vile hatred onto me.

            Its not the same — just because you tell me you want it to be that way, doesn’t make it so. Grow up and take some responsibility for yourself. Taking the labors of another to give to someone by force of law is immoral. Just as not giving charity willing to those that can’t do for themselves is immoral. Giving someone that doesn’t work because they’ve never taken responsibility for anything a phone is not kindness. It does nothing to help them. It just teaches them that they don’t need to contribute, just take.

            It is you, the rest of you liberal art educated, Godless idiots that keep bringing this up. Then when we repeat it back to you, you call us racists.

            You are mentally defective if you think I am the one that harbors racial hatred for anyone.

            I dislike for reasons of character, nothing more, nothing less.

          • http://twitter.com/mister8nine Emmanuel Stubbe

            “Taking the labors of another to give to someone by force of law is immoral.” you mean taxes? because I thought we settled that matter, that taxes in itself were not something to hate. it is another debate to say if they are too high or misused. You come back on your words. By the way, why did you run away from the other thread: afraid I might prove you wrong?

          • SpinMeNot

            Yes, I mean taxes. Taxes are necessary when used for good. Telling me that I need to pay more in taxes, because you want to give someone something to a friend that is starting a company to make a product that will never be able to compete in the market and then telling me my complaining makes me a racist is immoral. I don’t hate paying taxes, I don’t like my labors being taken by force with no benefit to anyone. And that is what happens. Over the past 10 years, some $850m in taxes subsidize the wages for union workers in the snack cars of Amtrak. how is that moral? Nobody subsidizes my salary, I don’t want them to.

            I should have never brought up morals, another Godless liberal that thinks man can define right and wrong without an frame of reference in God …

            Buckle up … the stupid is strong with this one.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            Morals? don’t get me started. god does not exist. There is no scientific proof, and relying on a 2000 year old book as a moral compass is dubious at best. The book called Bible is full of fairy tales that cannot be regarded as true by any logical thinking person. But that’s not the issue, everybody likes a fantasy now and then. The real problem is backward people like you trying to distill some morals from a hopelessly outdated book full of violence inciting passages. and don’t get me started on churches and other nefarious organizations that want to subdue the will of free men to their fantasies. I am glad we dealt with religious extremism 200 years ago in the French Revolution and kicked those bloodsucking clerics out of power

          • Sol Robinson

            Oh conservatives are not going to like that.

            I personally like to think there is a god, but I doubt he is anything like what could possibly be expressed in any sort of written word.

            I also wouldn’t mandate that opinion on anyone else.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            I am a European, not the socialist kind people in USA like to refer to, but I do not believe in god. I don’t mind people who do, to be honest nobody has proved there isn’t a god so actually we cannot scientifically prove he doesn’t exist either. the problem starts when religious people start using their religion as an argument for morals, or worse try to push their beliefs or views on others.

          • Sol Robinson

            Exactly.

            At BEST religious literature is a good, rough framework for morality.

            like the one about not killing people, that’s good. Lying? Also bad.

            But detailing about where penis’s can and can’t go, and demanding control over vaginas that do not belong to you, there’s no excuse for that.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            indeed, I regard the whole bible as a giant methaphore for teaching kids to behave. If you omit the crazy stuff. like an educational fairy book. that’s why I don’t mind people believing: it’ll keep them civil. and apparently they seem to draw hope from the book, with “prayers” which amazes me. All for the better: it saves them the money to talk to a real pyschologist

          • SpinMeNot

            Apparently you have failed to learn anything from it. I don’t come over to a European website and in my broken french or italian try to explain away my failure to grasp basic facts and present a cogent well reasoned argument that can withstand any level of cross examination.

            That is called behaving badly. I am not well, the medicines are keeping me from sleeping. I can do this all night.

          • Sol Robinson

            Indeed. I do recognize how, throughout history, religion has played it’s good parts as well. Faith can help some people get through crisis, and I wouldn’t belittle their beliefs for that. But just keep it to yourself people. If you think something is a sin, and other people don’t view it as such, just shove it. When people use their 2000+ words to define how the country should be run, it is silly!

          • Southern fried

            Well I am glad you dont mind and I have your permission. Yes because psychologists have all the answers right? All they want is your money and could care less if you get better. The reason is because they are human just like everybody else.

          • SpinMeNot

            There you go again, jumping to conclusions. At what point did I attempt to enforce my views on sexuality on you or anyone. On the other hand, it is you that is attempting to force yours on me. I believe in the biblical definition of marriage, you don’t. It can agree to disagree, and say no, I won’t recognize that as marriage. Your side side says that my side intolerant and rejects our feelings. Your feelings are more important. That is because they are all you have, you don’t have reason, you don’t critical thinking, You have been told what to think, what you deserve to be paid etc. etc.

            You convict yourself. I don’t even need to argue with you.

          • Sol Robinson

            Oh you are still here? I was talking to Emmanuel.

          • SpinMeNot

            Ah yes, the second idiot arrives, another village loses tourism.

            You too are more fun than I deserve.

          • Sol Robinson

            Ahh yes. Because I disagree with you, I am stupid. Genius. I’m curious: how do you define intellect? Who is smart to you?

            People who test high in school, high Iqs, etc etc?

          • SpinMeNot

            Martin Luther, Martin Luther King, Booker T. Washington, Lincoln, Kennedy, Reagan. Winston Churchill, Thomas Edison, Isaac Newton, D’Vinci, ….

            Intellect is the ability to reason on facts, not whether or not you can do differential equations. Intellect is ability, knowledge is fleeting, wisdom is priceless. I’ll take a wise man over a smart socialist like you any day of the week.

            Test scores are indicators, experimental results to be correlated and analyzed. nothing more, nothing less.

            They prove only what you either “got right” or “wrong”, they don’t test knowledge.

          • SpinMeNot

            You are a socialist. Your own words have shown as much. And like all irrational liberal socialists, you say it is not so, and the superiority of your will and intellect makes that true.

            I don’t use my religion an argument for my morals. By definition all morals are based in a belief in something larger. You confuse ethics with morals. There is a difference silly little citizen.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            you don’t even know what a socialist is, you never saw a self declared socialist power in party, you have not a single socialist politician in congress, you just apply your own definition of what socialism is to them. I live in Europe, there is a socialist party in my government right now so I know what I m talking about, you don’t.

            Morals are not based in a belief in something larger, it is clear you are a computer scientist. Any lawyer who has studied theories of law or philosophy like Plato, Socrates, Kant or Hegel can tell you morals are the normative axioma’s that govern society and on which laws are based. For instance murder comes from the consensus you can’t kill. The Bible took these norms and used them as a base for a religion that dictated a certain way of life. Ethics are about what is right or wrong and for what reasons, they are interrelated.

            Your condescending demeanor is laughable and a pathetic attempt to theorize over things you clearly don’t understand because they are way over your intellectual capacities. I will go now because I have better things to do than talk to a person who has no common decency or class whatsoever, and has proven to be a bigot.

          • Southern fried

            ever heard of bernie sanders??

          • SpinMeNot

            Really? And you know this how? You know where I spent my time prior this moment. Eastern Europe, Central Africa, Russia/USSR. Been there, seen it. China, Central America, Venezuela, blah blah blah.

            No actually you don’t understand socialism, and you’ve just proven. Let me explain this to you in the simplest possible terms I can. By definition, any country that is a member of the EU is in some measure operating under a socialist system of government.

            From a source that you liberal mental midgets seem to think is authoritative: ocialism (play /ˈsoʊʃəlɪzəm/) is an economic system characterised by social ownership of the means of production and co-operative management of the economy,[1] and a political philosophy advocating such a system. “Social ownership” may refer to cooperative enterprises, common ownership, state ownership, or citizen ownership of equity.[2] There are many varieties of socialism and there is no single definition encapsulating all of them.[3] They differ in the type of social ownership they advocate, the degree to which they rely on markets or planning, how management is to be organised within productive institutions, and the role of the state in constructing socialism.[4]

            The EU is the means by which cooperative management of the economy of once sovereign nations is now controlled.

            Ok, so what else did you get wrong. Morals, no Plato and Socrates wrote on ethics, morals are absolute ethics are relative. What is ethical in my country may or may not be ethical in your country. For example, some Muslim country, a husband has the ethical right to beat his wife or wives. That is never moral, ever.

            My limited intellectual capacity has proven your first two points to be incorrect. You don’t even understand that socialism is rampant in your neck of the woods and tell me I don’t understand things? You think that only people that belong to a political party that has some form of the word socialism in it can be socialist?

            And then we move back to you are allowed to get on this board, do whatever your twisted sense of socialist ethics tells you can do, and have the nerve to tell me I’m a bigot. What you are is a bitch that isn’t smart enough to know when to find a hole when the first rounds land.

            I’ve not missed a thing. I won’t miss a thing. If I see you on here, I’ll be right there with my size 12 kicking your lies into the gutter where they belong.

            You have no idea who I am, what I have done, and you need to get this straight my little socialist friend … I will not sit quietly by any longer while you and your ilk take this world straight in the crapper. You morons appeased evil 70 years ago, millions died. Not on my watch, not without a fight.

            Evil, that is what you are, and your poisonous ideas of entitlement, fair share, living wages and all those other broken tired impossible dreams of men that don’t have the intellectual capacity of a cabbage fart.

          • SpinMeNot

            Well, then they aren’t a conservative. They are a Republican, and like all good ignorant socialist citizens, you are too stupid to realize there is a difference.

          • SpinMeNot

            Neither is there any scientific proof thatwith God does not exist. Don’t start with me Socialist. I’ve already proven several times you don’t understand causality and correlation, I doubt you have can possibly have a proper grasp of the scientific process. Observe, hypothesize, experiment, evaluate. I acknowledge that I can’t prove to someone the existence of God, God does not require proof, only faith. Science on the other hand requires you to prove that there is not a force, the force I call God, that created the physical frame of spatial, temporal and material existence in which we exist.

            In science, you can either prove or disprove a hypothesis. you believe there is no God, you can no more prove he does exist than I can prove he does. I don’t have to, theology requires no such proof.

            Your statement, requires scientific proof. Oh and for the record, I am a scientist. computer scientist,

            I’ve got 40+ peer reviewed publications, have given invited keynotes at conferences related in the fields of telecommunications, ontology, software engineering and the mathematical modeling of systems. Look for papers about the FOCALE architecture, I am one of the principals.

            You are out of your league citizen. You put up less resistance then the French Army in the face of the Nazis. Your problem, no faith in anything.

            Ah and we have it. You are French. Yes,the aftermath of the French Revolution, good times there in France then wasn’t it.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            I’m not french you idiot, I merely referred to it’s Revolution. I’m Flemish. See that proves you have no reading skills or logic. Your record is totally irrelevant to the discussion. you hope to extract some authority from it. Typical for people who run out of real arguments: they start to go for the “argumentum ex autoritate”. a thing the Nazis did too, so maybe you should vote for a fascist party. O wait you already did: it’s called the GOP.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            by the way I already stated that there is no proof that god doesn’t exist. maybe read all my comments first before you start preaching.

          • SpinMeNot

            So you have no response to my faith doesn’t require proof, your science does. Prove to me scientifically that God does not exist or statement that He does not exist cannot be shown to hold true. There fore it is not.

            Do you understand, if not TRUE then FALSE?

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            i don’t have to respond because I don’t contest what you say, faith defeats the whole concept of proving something scientifically. If you can’t prove or empirically obeserve it, it doesn’t exist in my opinion. There is no argument against faith because it is beyond reason.

          • SpinMeNot

            Ok well, you guys lasted less time then French.

            Where have I run out of arguments? Give me one thing I have missed responding to and I’ll respond to it.

          • Sol Robinson

            BAZING!

          • SpinMeNot

            Thats bazinga dipstick. Ah yes, you’ve been talking with the other moron. We really need to keep you guys apart that much arrogance in one place could damage the space-time continuum.

            And for the record I am not a registered member of any political party or religion. I have to put up with hypocrites enough here.

          • Maria Seeger

            Maybe this is the difference between you who says there is no god (and you can’t prove there isn’t…merely saying God doesn’t exist doesn’t make it true)…but this verse from the outdated book you love to ridicule has been tickling my mind for sometime now:
            Paraphrasing now, 2 Thessalonians 3: 8,10…
            (Paul writing about himself and his fellow worker) …nor did we eat anyone’s bread free of charge, but worked with labor and toil night and day that we might not be a burden to you…For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat.”
            In other words, no free rides.

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            Great i’ll sure look it up, maybe fire up a prayer while I’m at it…No seriously, I sometimes ridicule this book, true, and I know I offend some people with it. But that is my freedom of speech. besides, i only do it to back off overzealous believers who try to curtail my freedom. Read my other comments, I do not oppose the concept of religion in itself. Only when it starts to organize itself in churches to impose it’s beliefs on others and kill people, I will protest. I’ve seen what it does, and history proves it as well. But you can go on and believe, along with others and share it with them. No problem.

          • Maria Seeger

            I actually wasn’t try to prove anything to you. I normally don’t make it a habit to share a verse with someone who doesn’t believe in the validity of Scripture. I just used this particular one because it’s been tickling my mind ever since these debates started and the liberal younguns’ started throwing hissy fits because of companies laying people off. I have 2 adult children myself, both of them hardworking taxpayers, and the mere thought of these whiny little liberal Democrats who feel that they can now demand that American business owners stay open because *they* say so because *they* feel like the American business owner is obligated to pay for Obama’s massive social programs.
            I think the “If you don’t work, then you don’t get to eat” is a pretty good rule myself. My children work, so they’re entitled to eat the food they earn the money to pay for. But they shouldn’t feel obligated to feed parasites.

          • Hiraghm

            And what would you suggest using as a moral compass? Rules for Radicals?

            Why would a 2000 year old tome be dubious as a moral compass? Are you aware that in the renaissance, the rebirth, it was ancient writings a thousand years old that renewed knowledge and brought about the rebirth.

            Man’s nature hasn’t changed in at least 6 thousand years. Perhaps we should dispense with the law of gravity, since Newton discovered it 300 years ago and Einstein refined it a whole century ago, now.

            Your argument is the argument of an effete child, who argues the wisdom of his elders is obsolete because it’s not wrapped in the shiny gaud of today’s flashy packaging.

          • Hiraghm

            You mean there are no white people who pay taxes? You mean the 50% of the population who pay 98% of the taxes aren’t white?

          • Hiraghm

            We aren’t responsible if you can’t understand how the English language works. (That fault lies with the public school system).

            See above.

          • Hiraghm

            It’s amusing. The media has announced since 2008 how the black population is in Obama’s pocket; 98% voted for him in 2008, I don’t know what the percentage is in 2012… 98% of whites, however, did NOT vote for McCain or Romney. Which is racist, hm? Fact: lots of blacks voted for Obama. Fact: some number of them *must* receive welfare, as 71 million Americans in general now take some form of welfare.

            It’s also a fact that some number of white people pay taxes. Note how the question was phrased; there was no comma. “…the white people who pay taxes…” not “the white people, who pay taxes”. No pause. No presumption that all white people pay taxes, or even that only white people pay taxes.

            the point being, you’ve been painting with a broad brush in order to condemn by implication all white people and all Republicans using false assertions. Yet, there are white people who do pay taxes, there are black people who do receive benefits from those taxes. It is a valid question to ask what the numbers are, when the main thrust of your arguments is racism.

          • SpinMeNot

            Define real american. I’m a grandson of an eastern european jew. A real American is anyone that comes to this country, learns the language, gets a job and gives more than he asks to be given.

            Call me a racist again coward, go ahead. My people have been crapped on longer than any.

            You are pathetic waste of resources. I said what I mean. I payed 30% of my income in taxes last year. I have no problem with people that made more and paid a lower percentage, because they’d already been taxed at least once before.

            You are a thief and coward. You cry racism because you failed to make something of yourself and want the property of others, but lack the strength of will or muscle to take it by force.

            Bring in it on candy-ass, I’m your worst nightmare.

          • Sol Robinson

            Oy, you have fallen to the party of neo nazi’s and ku klux klan? A sad day for us all.

            (Btw, CURRENT kkk, not past. http://kkk.bz/ if you must)

          • SpinMeNot

            Alright you piece of anti-semitic lying trash. My greatfather, great grandmother, great cousins, all of them killed by the Nazis in the Extermination Camps. My grandfather and two others had come to this country before the war to make a place for the rest.

            You are a such a man, give me an email address. I’ll send you my home address. Bring friends, bring lots of friends.

            Keep spewing your vile racist slurs, you prove my point for me.

          • Sol Robinson

            Um excuse me? That happened to my grandfather’s family as well.

            I was expressing how sad it was that someone who had a similar family situation to mine would have fallen in with those who represent the same values in america.

          • SpinMeNot

            Fallen in? You’ve forsaken the faith of Abraham and your ancestors.

            May your grand children curse you for the fool you are.

          • Sol Robinson

            Yes. Because the faith of Abraham MANDATED that I agree with people who accuse another religion of infiltrating our country and spreading their evil around. It’s not like that kind of language has ever been shown to be the product of evil itself, no, I should just sit back and listen to people who say that anyone of that religion who works in government should be investigated, or that they shouldn’t be allowed into the country.

            Yeah.

            Totally Abraham faith right there, gotta love that.

          • SpinMeNot

            Abraham mandated what? You really are delusional. Please tell me again how Abraham requires us to do anything but follow the Laws of God, as passed to us by Moses. The covenant between the Lord and Abraham is as follows:

            To make of Abraham
            a great nation and to bless those who bless him and curse those who
            curse him and all peoples on earth would be blessed through Abraham.[Gen 12:1–3]

            To give Abraham’s descendants all the land from the river (or wadi) of Egypt to the Euphrates. [Gen 15:18–21]

            To make Abraham a father of many nations and of many descendants and
            the land of Canaan as well as the entire Middle East to his descendant.[Gen 17:2–9]

            Circumcision is to be the permanent sign of this everlasting covenant with Abraham and his male descendants and is known as the covenant of circumcision.[Gen 17:9–14]

            And yes, I grabbed that off the net. Abraham mandated nothing of what you suggest.

          • Hiraghm

            Yes, it is sad that you’ve fallen in with the same values as those of the Nazis who demonized innocent people in order to gain political power, as you and the other progressives are doing.

          • Hiraghm

            Nazis are leftists, like all flavors of socialist. I don’t know what party is their party, but their ideology more closely aligns with that of the Democrats than that of the Republicans.

          • SpinMeNot

            Mr. Williams, spot on! well said.

          • Sol Robinson

            It is so sad that some of my people only learned to hate from what happened, while the rest of us learned to fight that hate instead.

            I am so sorry for you.

          • SpinMeNot

            You are a real piece of work. I expect some people like you turned my great aunts over to Einsatzgruppen Drei and watched while middle aged women were gunned down in the street.

            You dishonor any and all of your family that died in the Shoah. I pray that one day God takes the scales from your eyes.

          • Sol Robinson

            Right. Clearly, because I think your party espouses racial hatred, I would have let my people die in the streets. I’m curious, do you have any other insights into my character that could be divined from next to 0 knowledge of my life?

          • Emmanuel Stubbe

            don’t worry, this man SpinMeNot has clearly shown that he lacks even the most basic understanding of syntax, grammar, and overall reading comprehension. He is blinded by hate and unwilling to respond to points that are made or facts that are put forward. A bigot.

          • Sol Robinson

            I pity him. His family went through the same horrors I did, and he came out so sad and angry.

          • SpinMeNot

            Ok, well, since you kiddies refuse to tell me what I’ve ignored, continue to claim that I am not responding to your points of argument etc. Claim that you know what is in my heart, etc I am done for night. My wife tells me that I’m not doing anyone, even myself any good.

            If you come up with something new other than tired retreads of ideas that have failed time and time again, I’ll be impressed.

          • Sol Robinson

            Ok, I’ll post my idea for significant government cutbacks, give me a minute.

          • Sol Robinson

            I wrote this a while ago in regards to rising premiums, but instead the gains could be applied to any other sort of government expenditure: tax cuts, credits, etc.

            I am under the opinion that the ideal way to handle this problem is through adjusting the terms of the legislation, rather than simply striking it down. I had a couple of thoughts on that.
            Perhaps a tax credit to the companies if they keep their premiums the same rate, or lower them, to offset the loss of revenue? And maybe the loss of revenue to the government that this would cause could perhaps be offset by some spending cuts. In terms of where and what, I think that the best way to do that is rather than simply cut things we can’t afford, we streamline them. One area where this is a particular area of redundancy is something that isn’t talked about a lot: the intelligence community.
            According to the washington post, there are 1,271 government organizations that relate to the intelligence community. While I’m sure there are a large number of them that are other organizations that just deal with the intelligence community, this is an absurd number. Simply because of different bureaucratic practices, the amount of inefficiency here is probably pretty high. Why not at least combine 15 organizations that among them do 7 different things, and then split them back into 7 new agencies? This isn’t only applicable to this section of government obviously, but it’s the best example I could find. I mean obviously we don’t want to diminish the capacity of our necessary intelligence gathering network, but the idea would be to centralize groups that have most likely arisen due to compartmentalization of larger groups. Institute of blah needs a research division, which becomes research library blah. But also the something bureau needs a research division, so they have a separate one.
            Think about it: if you give lets say 50 million dollars to this network, by the time the specific groups who use the money for research and equipment (or even salary) purposes get their hands on it, it has gone through at least a dozen layers of separate chains of command.
            Not only would this have economic benefits because less interdepartmental liaison type people would be necessary, but in this case it would have really strong national security applications as well. A lot of the warning signs that led up to 9/11, and potentially even what happened in libya, were never shared because the individual pieces were held by different intelligence agencies, who are competitive in nature.
            Now I know classified secrets obviously complicate the issue with this example, but it also provides another unique indicator of how well this could work.
            Why not try to make some organizations completely non-confidential? Surely there could be a single research department for non classified work, like civilian applications of no longer cutting edge military tech.
            Despite the length of that example, the most important thing to take away from this is how much it could do if applied to other branches of government. Now despite the fact that this would displace many workers into an already struggling economy right now, this pitfall could be avoided if this was done gradually, merging organizations a few at a time, and over years.
            But think about this as well! The people who would be entering the private sector would be those who have been working their whole lives in a field, without a proper framework for potential creative exploration. AND THAT is where the private sector shines.
            Basically, this is the liberal argument against government inefficiency: how about instead of LESS government, BETTER government?

          • SpinMeNot

            No. how about less government. How about government get it hands out of toilet tanks, lighting fixtures, size of the engine in my truck, and all the other stupid ass crap that serves no purpose other than to remove freedom. How about government send 5th Group into the South of Side of Chicago and teach those backward-ass barbarians what men with purpose and mission can do to punks like them.

            The only better government is less government, at the federal level. Let the states mind themselves, and likewise the counties and cities. Let the federal government promote the general welfare of the country as a whole, provide for it its defense and stop stripping away the liberties of our citizens because stupid pukes like you don’t want to work as hard as old men like me.

            The general welfare of the country as whole has been improved by that stupid pig tailed bulbs how? If you break one, you’ve got a environmental contamination that requires some other Government Jackboot wannabe dictator to tell me that I have to now replace the damn carpet?

            Crap, yeah, that has helped a lot.

            Less is better, more is not. Greedy liberal pukes, more more more, gimme gimme gimme. *Picks up his M1 and says “Not on my watch Junior”.

          • Sol Robinson

            Well now it just sounds like you want to kill people in chicago.

          • SpinMeNot

            No not the people. The animals that say dragged the 14yr old off the street the other day and gang raped her.

            Here we go folks, the mental midgets are back with their strawmen, distortions, evasions, blah blah blah blah blah.

            The stupid is stronger with this one than I thought.

          • Sol Robinson

            ????

            Evil criminal people are still people. And I’m curious on how you would determine who would be killed?

          • SpinMeNot

            Ok I’ve been trying to respond to your drivel point by point. I’m too old and you are just too stupid to understand it. Let me summarize for you, I’ll try to keep my words small and limited to a few syllables so you and your ilk can understand.

            How about no. How about the government spends too damn much money already. How about we adjust the EMTALA and go with what works rather than lying about people being turned away at hospitals because their wasn’t a law to help them, when there was. Again, it wasn’t a lack of laws, if it happened, it was because of an immoral person or persons. The law was there. Costs for health care are going up because of your stupid need to enforce your ideas of fairness into the market. Fairness is an illusion, it does not exist. Driving on …

            If government got smaller, quit wasting money on snacks on Amtrak, paying of corrupt unions and buddies, etc they wouldn’t have to take any more money then they already are, their wouldn’t be any lost revenue in the private sector, and liberal progressive pukes like you could get on with real work rather than coming up with complicated solutions for problems that only exist because said liberal-progressive pukes don’t want to actually do any work and have created said problems by messing around with crap they ought not to be. Rattle snakes are dangerous critters, especially when you don’t understand them. You can’t grow the economy by taking more money out of the private sector and then yelling “TAX BREAK” and magically make money appear. Taking is confiscatory, not growth promoting. Why is it so hard for you stupid liberal progressive pukes to get that. Its math. you can not take and end up with more. It violates the scientific laws you idiots say we of faith don’t understand. Who doesn’t understand what here. You people really drive me nuts.

            One last point … your mindless diatribe about “loss of government
            revenue needing to be offset” — really? Its not revenue it taxes. I’m
            tired of you liberal-progressive pukes trying to make government out to
            be no different than the private sector. Government doesn’t have
            revenue, it collects taxes. Revenue is an attempt to make it sound
            nice. Screw it, its taxes. Taxes, taxes, taxes. You can’t take out
            1.00 and magically say well, when the government spends its revenue,
            that creates an additional $0.33 for every dollar they spend, unless
            you’ve borrowed that $0.33 from somewhere else.

            See, I used a lot less words than you, and my logic actually works. Government takes less out of the private sector, spend what they do actually take/need effeciently, and let the producers produce so you mindless consumers can consume.

            I think I’ve found all the carpet nuggets you and that little socialist gal-pal of yours left for me. If I’ve missed one, and you feel you aren’t getting enough attention, let me know. I’ll come back and tear down a few more of your poorly thought out suggestions.

            Just keep it simple Junior, life is a lot easier that way.

          • Sol Robinson

            You do know that it has never been shown that tax cuts for the rich grow the economy, right?

          • SpinMeNot

            Really are you going to drag this one out … the rich the poor the black the white …

            Listen up monkey humper. Tell Reagan … Ronald Reagan, weren’t you the one bringing him out. He cut taxes, and look what he got … double digit growth.

            And we have nothing but proof that increasing them kills an economy. Look a that hell hole that is the EU. Or talk to the Japanase, try the entire decade of the 1990s no growth because of taxation and financial chicanery in their banking system.

            You need to try harder, your liberal progressive overlords are no smarter than you are.

            Somebody else provide the troll a link please, I’m going to back to planing that door frame. Its smarter than this monkey-humper.

          • Sol Robinson

            And those numbers are just random, the 7 and the 15, read nothing into them.

          • SpinMeNot

            And so it begins. I’ve never met two loons like you guys before.

            Me thinks both of you use that work too much.

          • Hiraghm

            What makes you think there’s two of them?

          • SpinMeNot

            Ah, you may have something there … silly me.

          • Hiraghm

            save your projections, and I suggest you look up the word “bigot”. Pot. Kettle. Black.

          • SpinMeNot

            Right, and what is my party? What am I ? My state doesn’t require party registration. I willingly voted for a number of democrats and republicans at the local level.

            A man that thinks for himself vote the issue and the best man for the job. But you are anything but a rational or independent thinker. You are a race baiting, progressive idealist that can see the evil in the hearts of other men, yet be blind to the bias and prejudice of his own.

            You throw stones, deny having thrown the stone, accuse people of meaning something other than what they say, but tell me to trust that you mean what you say.

            where I live we have saying those that behave and think like you do, “Bless your heart…”.

          • Sol Robinson

            OOOOOOOOH

            I get it. Ignore everything I said; there is no amount of time that I could spend arguing with you that would ever work. Goodbye.

          • SpinMeNot

            Ignore what? You need to lay off the hooch. What have I ignore. You say you know what is in my heart. We both know that isn’t possible.

            Please, tell me what I’ve ignored? You really are thick.

          • Sol Robinson

            No I am telling you TO ignore everything I said. Disregard it; pretend it never happened. The amount of effort it would take for me to break you out of your cocoon is more charity than I care to do, for someone who rejects it.

          • SpinMeNot

            Ok, lets try this again Junior — You haven’t said anything. It has all been fabrications, distractions and attempts to confuse the issue at hand. And that issue is that you are a race-baiting liberal/progressive do nothing, take everything piece of trash that expects people with a command of the facts and moral character to just let you spew lies, innuendo and sow dissent.

            Not on my watch Junior. See ya in the funny papers.

          • Elaine

            Wait until he has to actually work and PAY for all those pretend FREEBIES! He’ll sing a different tune. :)

          • SpinMeNot

            I wish he would sing. I expect flailing of limbs, gnashing of teeth, the wailing of a pathetic excuse for a human being crapping his pants because he has to take responsibility for himself. Watching a male of the species loose control of their bowels due to cowardice is really nothing you ever want to see. Trust me on this one.

          • Hiraghm

            If you mean “the Republican party”, it does NOT espouse racial hatred. You can’t give any examples of where the Republican party has espoused racial hatred in any of its writings, positions or agendas. That is a slander perpetrated by the left, a projection of leftists’ own racism, exemplified by the constant focus on race.

          • Elaine

            Who exactly are YOUR people? I don’t get your argument here…

          • Sol Robinson

            Jews. SpinMeNot accused me of being someone who would have let my people die in the holocaust, because we disagree politically. It was in response to me pointing out how the current incarnation of the nazi ideology tends to vote; republican.

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            he misunderstood…he thought you were being sarcastic.

          • SpinMeNot

            Well, whatever it was I missed it. And in general, its a good bet that there is always a bit of sarcasm in anything I post.

          • Teresa Davis McCormick

            spin me not is not a racist or a lefty. you misunderstood.

      • http://www.facebook.com/rob.phelps.ind Robert Phelps

        you forgot war on freedom
        war on free speech
        war on right to have a gun
        more to come…..

        • Sol Robinson

          Ahh I’m sorry
          “War on 1920’s germany”
          “War on saying things that are horrible”
          and
          “War on ted nugent”

          Any more?

          • SpinMeNot

            What is your malfunction? Were you abused as a child. The only person here that thinks you are clever is you.

      • Hiraghm

        The war on women is real; it’s being conducted by the left, however, not the right.

      • TheOriginalDonald

        War On Poverty

    • Tony Gamino

      He was elected. That’s democracy.

  • Sonya A. Willis

    My head is going to explode from the idiocy of the liberal’s economics acumen.

    • TundraThunder

      Those of us who understand economics are going to need a lot of duct tape.

  • https://twitter.com/AlessaRosewater Maria

    All of those Liberals probably don’t have a job much less know anything about running a company! Obama IS trying to do away with the coal industry, and businesses in general.

  • Tom Schneider

    No, it is Obama who is the monster for his horrible treatment of the coal industry through his EPA.

  • David B

    Lead like Sheep to the slaughter, How dare he preserve his company’s existence by making a tough business decision. Thank goodness we have Obama there to to take care of them. Maybe they can get a job at the local Solar Panel factory, Oh yeah they were all let go also, only after spending $400,000,000 of tax payer’s money…Bone Heads……

  • Dlozee

    The ill-informed lefties, how ridiculous their thought-process or lack thereof, is!!! Companies have had contingency plans for a year or so in case this idiot was re-elected! The small company my husband owns is hanging by a thread and i can’t remember the last time he brought home a paycheck. Meanwhile I get MY ass out of bed at 4:30am to work in a pediatric cancer center to earn a paycheck go keep our household afloat, in turn paying taxes to enable someone else to sit on their government funded ass and see their kids for more than 2 hours a day. We’re not firing or not hiring as an act of revenge you morons-we simply CAN’T due to all the new taxes coming to crush us. So before you call someone UNAMERICAN for trying to keep a business afloat, quit drinking the blue KoolAid and look beyond the verbal diarrhea being spewed by the lame stream media

    • David B

      Amen Sister

    • Ben Ulferd

      I agree, all those voters in 2008 who voted republican, 70% of which take entitlements, suck our great country dry, oh wait……….

      • Hiraghm

        73% of people who quote statistics make them up.

        • Ben Ulferd

          Nate Silver says “Hi”

      • SDN

        I haven’t been, but I will be.

    • Hiraghm

      Just because you might want to know for future usage… “verbal diarrhea” is also known as “logorrhea”.

  • Ben Ulferd

    Well, this is slightly offset by the elevator/garage company that now will resume their work and remain open for another year.

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002109532283 Jillane Kent

      Will said company be able to compensate for all of the lost jobs that we’re learning of?

      • Ben Ulferd

        Did say slightly, but that depends if Leno and fellow out-of-touch millionaires follow suit. I would assume once they get a glimpse of Mitt’s new elevator, envy will set in.

        • Liberal Hater

          Your mom is still in business as well. Unfortunately, she did have to cut her rates a little. I tipped her an extra quarter though.

          • Ben Ulferd

            Well, she always did charge per inch, might explain your discount

  • http://alert-up-usa.com/ AlertUpUSA

    Since when did survival become revenge?

    Are these dumbos naïve or are they simply unable to comprehend what it takes to run a real business.

    Real business does not subsist on handouts from the government or government backing or government bailout. If the business survives this because it is a successful business if the business fails it is because it is a unsuccessful business? Or could it be – that the burdens placed upon it by a demanding government are just too much for it to survive?

    Are these people really serious about these non-reality based statements? Talk about out of touch!!!

  • Steve_J

    Of course it’s always someone else’s fault. Couldn’t be the policies put in place by Obama and his henchmen.

    • Ben Ulferd

      Right, like that time Obama stood in front of the Coal plant and stated “I will not create jobs or hold jobs that kill people, and that plant kills people”, oh wait, that was Romney. Hmmm, sounds like Murray would have had to layoff workers regardless.

      • Steve_J

        What policies has Romney implemented that would have caused Murray to layoff anybody?

        • Ben Ulferd

          Just citing a quote while Romney was governor against Salem Harbor Coal plant, just as this article quotes Obama in 2008. It doesn’t mention any of Obama’s policies, because there aren’t any. This is part of the EPA and Clean Air Act, which has been around for 40 years, and the restrictions that Murray speaks of won’t affect any existing coal plants, just new ones yet to be built. The truth of why coal plants are closing and why Murray is having layoffs is because natural gases are just cheaper, and since this is a capitalistic country, power companies are buying more of the cheaper natural gas. This is nothing other than the American way, and Murray has veiled this as a shot against Obama.

          • Hiraghm

            Well, the quote is truthful, because Romney didn’t create any jobs or hold any jobs, because gov’t doesn’t create or hold jobs (outside of the parasitic public sector, of course).

  • DianaRae_FL

    I love that my business is in Florida and non-Union. We are a right to work state. They can bitch all they want to. WE BUILT IT. We can let them go too.

    • Jim Denney

      Card check is coming, I suggest you purge your workforce of any whiners now before the NLRB appoints them as union organizers.

  • CLCRichmond

    what is the web site? I have never seen so much whining in a comment section. Is this website somehow linked to Fox news? Ted Nugent? Rush? Whine bitches whine.

    http://artofmanliness.com/2011/08/19/lose-with-dignity-celebrate-with-grace-part-i/

    • SwTk

      You won Sponge, you won. But WHAT have you won? Does your vagina breath a sigh of relief? Do you get to get yo food stamps? What is it my man? What do you get out of this?

    • Liberal Hater

      I hope your loved one dies from lack of care from Obamacare. You’re welcome. Call me so I can help you dig the graves.

  • torpedoman2002

    You liberals were warned this would happen. When Obama care was passed businesses all over America said they would have to lay people off if this law was not repealed. You ignored then and this is what happens. If you want someone to blame go look in a mirror you idiots. Maybe next time you will research the candidate you want to vote for and not vote for their skin color.

  • Terry in GA

    Wasn’t Lockheed *asked* by the Obama Administration to wait until after the election to announce 125,000 layoffs? This is only the beginning of a downward spiral.

    • Concerned4us

      Lockheed is one of my company’s biggest clients and we heard from them 6 months ago that they were planning to do a massive layoff Jan 1 if O was re-elected. By massive I mean 100K pink slips. So what you’re saying sounds about right since we’ve heard the same thing from Lockheed. We had hoped this wasn’t true. They’re one of our biggest clients so if it is true guess what that means for us?

      • Hiraghm

        You’re evil, vindictive bat turds who are gonna lay off a bazillion employees just to spite Obama? Am I warm? /sarc

        • Concerned4us

          Haha, I’m not personally laying off anyone. And I don’t know how constructive name calling is. But I do understand the frustration everyone is feeling because of the grievous mistakes the Obama administration has made to get us here. But the reality of the Boeing and possible Lockheed layoffs is that these companies support the military and O has, in his infinite wisdom, expressed a wish to downsize the US military. Because the US has no enemies, right? and 9/11 and the tragic loss from that violence was not a strong enough message I guess. At the very least this nation needs to open up its eyes at what consequences electing O will have. Poverty, broken dreams, struggle, and fear of our enemies resulting from a weakened military. I wish you and yours the best in these upcoming, trying times.

  • GoSellCrazySomeplaceElse

    Every day I say to myself, “Self, these idiot liberals couldn’t get any more idiotic, could they?” And the very next calendar day I find myself repeating it again.

    • Paul Andrusko

      Spot on AND hiarious GoSell

    • Emmanuel Stubbe

      for a start conservatives could try to present arguments, instead of posting mindless quotes about people whose opinions they don’t understand.

      • Hiraghm

        NOBODY understands those people’s opinions… not even themselves.

  • Terry_Jim

    If a CEO thought he could hire MORE employees right now,
    if a company could expand their operations and create MORE jobs and profits,
    one would, & beat the others in the marketplace.
    They can’t.
    They can’t, and have to reduce their operations, not out of spite for the POTUS, but because the regulatory climate of this administration is anti-capitalist, anti-free market.

    • Ben Ulferd

      Actually, it’s the free market that is the reason coal plants such as Murray Energy are having layoffs or are closing. Natural gas is cheaper, power companies are buying the cheaper alternative, and coal companies can not compete. The very definition of free-market and capitalism.

      • Terry_Jim

        I was thinking generally of CEO’s and business owners, not merely the coal industry or this coal company. Point is that the decisions of Murray Energy Corp and all the other companies are not spiteful political statements, but market based decisions.- in a marketplace skewed against expansion by the Obama White House

        • Ben Ulferd

          I do disagree on the political statement, at least in this specific case with Murray, as the prayer that was made public was clearly a shot at Obama and the people who voted for him. It’s his right, but while his company and many other coal companies are either closing or having layoffs, natural gases companies are flourishing and hiring. I live in PA, and fracking has created tons of jobs and opportunities in our area. This is simply a microcosm of capitalism. As in all verticals, if you can get something just as good and cheaper, that’s an easy decision to make. I personally don’t think Obama’s policies

    • Hiraghm

      They can’t figure it out; everything leftists do is emotion-driven, so they can’t figure out when people have to make tough decisions that might well be contrary to their emotions…

  • Cabover_Country

    All of these CEOs are just making the EXACT same maneuvers (with regard to the tax code) that obama & every other democrat makes to keep their tax bill as low as possible.

  • ERMERGERD

    Don’t feed the trolls, guys.

  • C J

    YOU PEOPLE ARE THE ONES WHO ARE Unconscionable,despicable humans !!!

    HOW MANY Small business owners came onto these sites and tried to tell you this was coming …. IT IS not revenge but, The Small Business companies CANNOT AFFORD Obamacare !! You Ignored every warning from these business owners, you had a chance for a real turn around and you blew it !! YOU WERE WARNED !! SUCK IT UP AND FACE THE CONSEQUENCES OF YOUR ACTIONS !!! NO BODY WANTS TO HEAR YOUR WHINING AND BLAMING NOW !!

  • http://twitter.com/redsoxunixgeek Smitty 

    The Same Bob Murray who instead of keeping his workers safe and paying for Saftey upgrades at his mine, cost 6 workers their life.

    The Same Bob Murray who sent his miners to a Romney Rally without pay.

    http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/12wyyn/yesterday_i_was_laid_off_because_president_obama/

    • Hiraghm

      You’re right, he’s terrible. Let’s shut down his operation entirely! That’ll teach him to lay off 160 workers…

  • v1cious

    No surprise you left out that this guy runs one of the worst coal mining operations in america: http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/sfisk/murray_energy_turns_captina_cr.html. Whatever fits your narrative I suppose.

  • Jeff

    if you look at the post Tuesday stock price of any coal stock, you’ll see they tanked and vastly underperformed an already cratering stock market, so Murray’s actions seem consistent with the prospects for rest of the companies in the sector

  • Let’em Crash

    I wish I could agree completely with the comments below about free market driving coal’s demise, but realize somewhere, a coal power station will always need a twice daily 40 car train load for continuous generation. Right now, the governments of the northwestern states are fighting increased deliveries to the buyer China, as just one example.

    • Karl H

      you are right and under President 0 the number of coal fired plants that have closed is 111 that is 222 40 car trains of coal per day that are not being delivered. Oh and do not forget that taxes the rest of the system so it sure will suck to be old and not able to endure sustained power outages. Those power outages are coming to a city near you btw. Who needs death panels when the EPA will act as executioner to the elderly. But even if the power can stay on the price is going to be beyond the reach of the poor. So when you read about the elderly dying or kids living in horrendous conditions just remember to thank a liberal progressive democrat. No one loves to kill defenseless human beings like a good old socialist democrat.

  • ted

    @SpinMeNot, you would have had a much better chance than Romney in this election. Consider running in 2016. You have my vote!

  • TocksNedlog

    WHOM, exactly, do these libtards think these “greedy, heartless, soulless businessmen” are getting ‘revenge’ against?
    “Higher” education, indeed.

  • tomtom1983

    Yea the fault is all with you libs, though I’m beginning to wonder if you on the left have some attention deficit disorder because this was neither secret nor retaliatory its just the consequence of Obama and his non existing leadership.

    Even your messiah mentioned it as he covered it up until after his drone like base with no brains casted their vote for him.

    Just to break the shock before hand, your taxes ARE going up, unemployment IS going to explode, gas and food prices WILL rise and health care WILL degrade severely. Though these happenings were also told to you on the left but you probably didn’t see that either.

    You liberals really take the cake when it comes to lack of focus and hearing impairment, really.

    We tried to warn you borderline, mentally deficit morons of what would happen if Obama and his cronies retain power. You didn’t listen, liberals never do, so buckle up and get ready for a bumpy ride because its only getting started, you have no idea the hardships and chaos you just placed on us all.

    Idiots! Lol!

  • Judy B

    Elections have consequences, & the consequences of a second Obama term will be wide spread, & devastating…so batten down the hatches, hell to pay is on it’s way.

  • Christene

    After reading the liberal tool tweets, what comes to mind,….pray for them.
    How many of them are sent from America, or from inside a mosque?

  • Back 4 More

    This is just the beginning. It won’t stop until the socialist agenda is complete. This country is going down and half of its residents are cheering its demise.

  • lillymckim

    Gee I didn’t hear a peep from these same people about Lockheed and Boeing playing hide the pink slips for Obama until after the elections? Oh the faux outrage …
    you “won” remember?

  • skhpcola

    These people can’t see the forest for the trees. They are clearly too stupid to be unsupervised in public.